by ALISTAIR BOMPHRAY
This is going to be a quick one today. I just got back from a weekend backpacking trip in the Sierras and was more than a little surprised to discover over three hundred new comments in the Teacher, Revised mailbox, many of them covered in a suspicious Anthrax-like powder or emitting a strange ticking sound.
I’m not going to lie. I read less than a quarter of them. And I didn’t make it all the way through Jesse’s post either.
The Geeks vs. The Idiot. Homeschools vs. public schools. Yawn.
I don’t have much patience for that kind of a discussion. And I fear that most of our readers (excepting the thousands of homeschoolers who visited our site this weekend), tuned out about as quickly as I did.
Obviously, tone was an issue for me, on both sides of the argument. But mostly it was the lack of complexity. There are wonderful things about homeschooling. And there are some not so wonderful things. It can be done really well, and it can be done not so well. The same goes for public schooling.
As a public school teacher who knows very little about homechooling, I would love to know what it takes to be a good homeschool teacher. I have questions like, How do you balance being both parent and teacher to your child? How do you incorporate technology into your lessons? How do you go about teaching a subject you know very little about? How much homework do you give? Is it even called ‘homework’ when it’s assigned at home? Do your students have to take the same standardized tests as mine? If so, how much test prep do you do each week? In short, I want to know your best (and worst) practices.
And as homeschool teachers, aren’t you just as curious about the life of a public school teacher? If for nothing else, to rethink and reshape your own teaching philosophies?
That’s why I want a discussion that readily includes all of those complexities, that examines all sides of the issue(s) in a way that is both intellectually curious and generous. This was and is my vision for Teacher, Revised.
Public school teachers aren’t competing with homeschool teachers, for the love of God (who, I must say, played a strange role in this weekend’s exchange). We’re all teachers here, and therefore we’re all in this together. You love your students as if they were your own children, because, well, they are your own children. Well, we public school teachers try to do the same.
Forgive me if I sound a little like the Steve Carell character from Anchorman when he yells, “I DON”T KNOW WHAT WE’RE YELLING ABOUT!” But that’s kind of how I feel.
Deep breath. Now exhale.
People can take sides, point fingers and bicker endlessly, but I choose to take the road less traveled and my family is enriched because of it.
I am a public school teacher who took a 13 year hiatus to home school my children. My oldest son graduated Friday night at a AZ Families for Home Education graduation ceremony. My son was cheered on by my husband & I, my parents, his siblings, his closest home school friend and 6 Cortez public high school teammates/buddies. And he ticked off at least one uptight volunteer by wearing his orange bandana under his graduation cap in memory of Stephen, a Thunderbird High School student who was an inspiration to Josh in youth group before he died the summer of Josh’s freshman year.
How is that possible?
Because we are truly committed to educate our children in a way that is tailored to meet their unique individual needs. And we are willing to cross the educational divide and fraternize with public schoolers to do it.
For our oldest, that meant home schooling all the way through. We have participated in a support group Kindergarten through 8th grade; I’ve been the leader for many of those years. I am a vocal advocate for home schooling. I can’t count the number of field trips my son has been on out in the “real world” instead of stuck in a classroom. He’s been able to experience several years of fencing, win a speech contest, participate in National History Day, attend Boys’ State, volunteer as a junior lifeguard, work as a paid life guard, work at a summer camp, ace a 3 credit class at the local community college, participate in the Phoenix Police Explorer program, be the last man standing on his tactical team to secure 3rd place in an event at the Chandler Competition, participate in several Civil War reenactment events, learn how to long board, become a master of the grill, volunteer on a church tech team, take the basic scuba class, go on 2 mission trips, escape to a wilderness adventure with his younger brothers and read more books than many read in a lifetime. I could actually go on and about the opportunities he has had because of the flexibility of home schooling, but you get the idea.
In high school, we encouraged him to take his love of swimming and participate on our local public high school’s swim team. GO COLTS! At Cortez, he also dabbled in tennis one year and took 2 semesters of Spanish and 1 semester each of marketing & algebra. He ate lunch with his buddies for a semester. That group of 10 plus guys are regular visitors to our house and truly welcome. 6 of them made the trip to the Civic Plaza downtown for graduation among the alien home school crowd. Josh’s younger brother is in piano & orchestra and takes Spanish there as well. He is on the swim and track teams. He loves hanging out with the guys from Cortez too. I was the teacher sponsor of a team of my 2 home schooled teens and 2 Cortez students at the Junior Achievement Stock Market Simulation last fall. I am thankful for many teachers, students and staff at Cortez for their part in educating and socializing my sons. There have been some negative experiences but those have been character builders and preparation for the real world. My sons will not flounder as adults because of being too “sheltered”.
My sons truly have had the “best of both worlds”. This was possible because I believe there are strengths and weaknesses in both home schooling and public school. We choose to strive to be a part of the strengths of both. And identify and avoid or compensate for the weaknesses we observed in either. Our family has benefited greatly and are truly grateful that we live in America where there is this freedom to do so.
My greatest wish for public schools is to give them a proven advantage of home schooling—that they have the means to reduce student-to-teacher ratios and that they increase field trips and embrace creative programs like National History Day, Future Cities Competition, Junior Achievement, The Jason Project, Fiesta Bowl Aerospace Challenge and more.
My hope for home schoolers is that they have an open mind in educating their child(ren) and to maximize the possibilities rather than getting stuck in a rut of doing what is comfortable or easy or “safe” for the parents.
In the end, it should be all about educating and socializing our children, not polarized camps of “public school” or “home school”.
Thankyou for this post. I just happened to fumble on this site..and was also surprised at the amount of commentary on what I had assumed was a nonissue. I have been priviledged enough to live in a community where homeschooing versus public schooling is pretty mute. But, here it is. I thought we had gotten over a lot of this a decade ago. So..I would be happy to answer your questions as they fit for my family. But as many have stated, each family is different. This is our philosophy and what works for us:
I have questions like, How do you balance being both parent and teacher to your child?
I never pretend to be a teacher. We are not in school. Just as I did not try to emulate day-care when my children were toddlers, I did not try to emulate a school when they were older. I am their mom, learning is important. We set aside a few hours each day to study. All of us.
How do you incorporate technology into your lessons?
We limited their use of technology until our children were in their early teens. It does not seemed to have hampered them in any way. We now have an 18 year old who is a junior in electrical engineering at UTAustin and a 16 year old studying computer systems at the local C.C.
How do you go about teaching a subject you know very little about? I don’t. We research it and if we want more information we ask proffesionals.
How much homework do you give? We don’t. I ask our boys to study independently 4 hours a day when they are in highschool. This is simply to develop study habits when they attend college. I don’t care what they study.
They do, however, often have homework from their weekly home-school co-op or from the local community college when they start their. (Usually as soon as they turn 16)
Do your students have to take the same standardized tests as mine? No. Only for college. SAT’s and ACT’s
If so, how much test prep do you do each week? In short, I want to know your best (and worst) practices. We have an SAT for Dummies type book. It has worked for us.
And as homeschool teachers, aren’t you just as curious about the life of a public school teacher?
A little. I come from a family of educators (public school and liberal arts universities). I once took a semesters worth of education classes to see if we were missing something. The classes were primarily about classroom-management and tests my children don’t take. It would be helpful if I was a classroom teacher. I am not. I have 4 boys living and learning with me.
If for nothing else, to rethink and reshape your own teaching philosophies? Once again, learned more from independent research then I ever did in a university ed philosophy type class.
Thanks for asking.
I was a public school teacher as well and never dreamed of homeschooling. Not until I sent my first guy to all day kindergarten and he was reading. Teacher ratio was 32 to one with aid, plus my guy was minority as we live in a Spanish speeking comunity, he nor the teacher spoke the language. My guy who loved to learn was fading fast in the confines of a desk without challeges. It seemed he would be left behind until the others caught up. We tried teaching him Spanish, no go, he became depressed.
It turns out I was homeschooling my kids all along and did not realize. So I pulled him out and continued along my Mom journey. I soon met a lot of like minded parents, we formed a co-op. Lots of fun and fieldtrips for younger guys, singing, boys, and girls club, gym class, t-ball, gymnastics, art….YMCA camp with homeschoolers.
Since we were all intellegent gifted woman we divided the teaching duties and grades preK-12. We meet on Friday as a school, set up a Church classrooms and get to work! We have preschool, kindergarten, Science for all grades, writing all grades, Spanish all grades, Art all grades, History or Social studies all grades, Math pre Algebra, Alebra, Geometry, Algebra II, no Calculus yet. We offer writing IEW and Writers Jungle All grades, and Public speeking, Economics HS. Our teachers are committed, work for free or very little if we hire, We have women with PHD’s in Chemistry and Math, master in Art and History.
It is a wonderful experience, and my family cherrishes the bonds we have made. We communicate online group, kids have sylabus and Moms read chapters or assign reading, make sure lab reports,vocab, math, reading lit. and writing papers are done.
I admit it can be challenging to get your own kid to work at subject they are not strong in. However all is due on Friday and they get it done. We have had state champ and award winning lego robotics teams. We have a ski club and ski all day on Wendsdays, no one there! We serve in youth groups, at a thrift store, my sons and daugter each have latest technology and know how to opperate and repair, laptops, and video systems. Learned this all on their own. I have teens now and they work independently mostly. We use online classes to help during the week. My daughter sings on youthband in church, has written a novel, she is 12, and makes movies, and takes gymnastics.
My sons have been on various missions trips, repairing houses.
They are athletes, both excellent baseball players, and my one son, coming out of 8th grade undeafted varisty football team.
My kids work at MOPS (mothers of preschoolers) teaching and watching babies, and kids. They all serve in younger Sunday school classes as well as taking their own. They help the elderly as well, and all our older neighbors. They all know how to cook and clean,type and balance a budget.
Yes we take tests, yes they study, yes they recieve grades in co-op classes, graded by other teachers. Yes we take standardized test, no we don’t study for them, just take at end of school year in proctored groups.
Our co-op has a big Spring Showcase to show off the kids achievements, ranging from a Science fair, (grades 5th thu 12th are assigned a project or experiment.) They can choose based on the class. Last year I had helped my daughter grade 6 assemple a real pumping heart from fish tank tubes and coolaide..she also wrote a paper. This for Life Science. My son in Physical science is assempling a video game in a toaster, I think it is about currents and charges. The other for Biology is regenerating Planierians and recording results.
We are very busy, no time to clean the house sometimes. But we are in the home stretch. Next year I will send my oldest to Community college to supliment his education, We do not have HS Spanish III, at co-op. In the meantime my freshman son 15 is working at a kids party place, paid job! Baseball is starting, And we are trying to see if we can get approved to play High school football for next fall. Tough to get done in a state that has just allowed districts to choose if they will allow.
Is it easy to homeschool. Yes, and no. It takes alot of commitment. Buying curriculum and planning. Plus all the driving and teaching and nagging. I am very pleased with my kids thou. They are ahead in Math and Science. Have time to develope their own hobbies and interests and serve in the community. I do not think they are sheltered either, just grounded and healthy.
So, I do appreciate public school teachers, I also know most love the kids. I love my 4 art classes and each and every kid! Ilove the Sunday school kids I teach, and I love my youth group girls.
I would agree that as homeschool Moms we have alot in common with public school teachers. Only, we get to tailor our childrens education based on their abilities. We can move faster or slower and have more one on one time.
……And as homeschool teachers, aren’t you just as curious about the life of a public school teacher? If for anything else, to rethink and reshape your own teaching philosophies?…..
Nope. I went to public school for 11 years (graduated early, and experienced many teachers during that time. I had relatives who were teachers, and were often regaled by their experiences. I have friends who were and are ps teachers. There is no lack of chatter and dialogue about how things are for ps teachers.
I prefer to hear my law school daughter’s discussions about the teaching formats and information utilized in her classes, having college professors over for dinner and NOT discussing teaching methodology but real subjects.
Factory model schools are a relatively new invention, derived form the Prussian model of education. You want to learn? Read John Taylor Gatto, immerse yourself in John Holt, both former ps teachers that had the scales pulled off their eyes. The box you paint yourself in is narrow and restrictive, despite your illusions of being diverse and inclusive. The Magna Carta, Bagavad Gita, and the majority of pre-1800 great literature did not come from public schooling educated persons. Much in the world has improved since earlier times, but not everything modern is better. Learning is a lifelong quest, something homeschoolers are aware of and treasure.
Cheers Mr. Bomphray, I appreciate your curiosity. But please don’t try to understand homeschoolers based on what you get in response to your post or any others! Imagine trying to get a read on Christianity that way, when it is represented by extremes from Fred Phelps to Al Sharpton, and every point in between. Homeschooling is radically different for every family, and you simply won’t be able to generalize based on what you hear. That is why people homeschool.
That said, last year someone asked a similar question of homeschoolers, and many bloggers wrote responses. Here is mine:
http://redseahomeschool.wordpress.com/2008/07/27/some-questions-about-homeschoolers/
And here is the original post with many other links and responses, if you’re really curious.
http://hwoolard.blogspot.com/2008/07/homeschoolers-help-me.html
A “short” response to your specific questions as they apply to my family *only*: We have a good homeschooling day when we learn through conversation about something we’ve just read or done — when we are just talking and freely sharing our ideas, even experimenting without being wrong. “Technology” for technology’s sake is a pet peeve of mine — my children (now 10 and 6) both use computers, but learning to use a computer is something most anyone can pick up along the way as they need to. When my daughter was in school “computer” class was the biggest waste of time all week.
(Note: this may not be true in areas where many students do not have access to computers at home. We live in a middle class area of Minnesota, and my daughter went to public school in an upper middle class neighborhood. Half of these kids could have taught the teacher about using a computer. And as far as diversity — I’m not sure how diverse a neighborhood public school in an upper-middle class area of Minnesota can be. I’m pretty sure our homeschool co-op is waaaayyyy more diverse. Maybe in other towns the neighborhood schools fly in a cross-section of kids from other parts of the world?)
My oldest daughter is learning Chinese and German at home, and my youngest is learning Spanish. I don’t speak any of these languages — we employ classes, software, online materials and tutors. I’m pretty sure I can handle math up til high school, and homeschoolers get teacher’s manuals just like you guys!
More generally, though, homeschooling is not about imparting my information to my children. It is about learning together, or me facilitating their learning. Children are born to learn just like they are born to sit up, walk, and eat. They need a helping hand, patience, and attention to achieve some of these things, but they don’t need formal lessons for everything. Give them books, talk to them, go places — they soak it up and ask for more.
Am I curious about the life of a public school teacher? Not especially. See, I live out in the world where I come into contact with public school teachers and many other types of people every day!
Apart from that, many homeschool families we know are former or current teachers (at our co-op we have a professor, a former professor — that’s me — and some public school teachers who continue to keep their licenses current). Also, because homeschoolers are very much a minority, most people we know send their kids to public school. It really is not a mysterious foreign world to us — however strange and mysterious we may seem to you. 
I am another homeschooling parent who knows what it is like to be a public school teacher (counselor and principal as well). There are several parents in our local group who once were public school teachers. Not one of us sit around and bash public schools. We just decided that public schools were not best for our children.
The author of the posts from this weekend reminded me of some of my former co-workers when they learned of our plans to homeschool. That narrow view of thinking is truly frightening.
Even more frightening, is the fact that an educator will state that another group is wrong without having any real information.
My comment is turning into a long post. I will continue my thoughts in a post on my blog later today.
Please contact me if you decide that you would like a writer on your blog with knowledge of both the homeschooling and public school worlds.
Kathryn Russell makes a good point: most of the great creative thinkers and writers before the 20th century were not educated in public schools, and certainly not in public schools run in anything like the way current schools are run by unionized faculty and unable to exclude students who do not want to play by the rules and learn.
Her sur-namesake Bertrand Russell, one of the greatest mathematical and philosophical geniuses of the 20th century, was privately educated (as the English say) as was perhaps the greatest 19th advocate of classical liberal tolerance and open inquiry, John Stuart Mill. Mill was largely taught by his father in his early years, something like what we would now consider home schooling.
The great public schools in America, and in Europe, in the past, were nothing like the warehouses of multiculturalism we see today: they were often selective in admission (and certainly selective in retaining students), taught a curriculum similar to that of private schools with similar rigor, and did not tolerate anti-social behavior.
I’m not curious about how public school teachers do it because I spent twelve years in the system plus three more years as a volunteer in the system when my first two children were enrolled in public school. I admire the many teachers who do it well and love their students.
I’m not curious because I have friends who teach. I have heard many stories about what they do and I have even had the good fortune to “job shadow” one of my teaching friends as part of my master’s degree program. She is a wonderful teacher. And yet many of these same teachers have encouraged me in my homeschooling and agreed that public school is not always the best choice for students.
As for your curiosity about homeschooling…there are lots of books out there if you would like to read about the philosophy and mechanics of homeschooling, as well as books about personal experiences. Homeschoolers are very diverse, so each family goes about it in a little different way. Take the time to get to know a few homeschooling families! As long as we don’t feel that we are being judged, we would be glad to talk about what it is that we do.
I must say, your approach to this topic is refreshing. Nothing like the attack in previous posts.
First, I would like to point out the reason God played a big role in the discussion this weekend is because one of your writers took it upon themself to speak inaccurately for Him. People thought that needed correction.
To answer a few questions:
1) Yes, I do talk to public school teachers. I have aunts, friends, cousins, sisters and brothers-in-law, a mom and a grandparent all working in the public schools. I’m quite familiar with their practices. Although they may strive to love their students as if they were their own, I can assure you they do not.
2) How do I teach a subject I know little about? I’ll turn it around: How do you learn about a subject you know little about? You ask questions. You research. You look for guidance through people with experience. There are more resources available to those of us who homeschool than there are public teachers. You are confined by what textbooks you are told to use and approved field trips. We can visit the zoo and talk to a keeper to find out about a specific species of animals. We can visit the water treatment plant to find out about our resources. We can take our children on family vacations and visit Plymouth Rock and other historical landmarks. Our options are endless.. yours are not.
3) How do I balance teacher/parent: I don’t. I am both. When I taught my children to eat with a spoon, I didn’t have to take them away from the home and set him up in an educational environment. When I taught them to walk, I did it in the comfort of my own home. I have been teaching my children since they were born and they haven’t yet been confused by it.
4) Because I have many hours (including evenings and weekends) where I can have one-on-one teaching/learning with my child with no interruption of other students, bells ringing, classroom changes, there is very little need to assign additional work outside of our typical day. Learning doesn’t stop which might account for the higher ACT scores from homeschool students.
5) All states have different laws governing homeschooling but yes, our children take the same standardize tests… and historically outperform public and private school students.
“As a public school teacher who knows very little about homechooling, I would love to know what it takes to be a good homeschool teacher. I have questions like, How do you balance being both parent and teacher to your child?”
Teaching is part of parenting. I don’t balance anything. I have been my child’s teacher since birth. It is all part of parenting in my book.
“How do you incorporate technology into your lessons?”
We use the internet to supplement our lessons. We use computer programs for foreign language instruction as well as supplements to other areas. We watch DVDs and videos via the internet as well. My 7 year old is independent on the computer. He has been using it for over 5 years. He has his own blog where he does many writing assignments. He is currently becoming proficient in typing. My kids have have lessons in how to use a digital camera as well.
“How do you go about teaching a subject you know very little about?”
I study the topic until I have a good handle on it. I do lots of reading and research. Last year we did an in depth study on dinosaurs and I did not know much about that topic beforehand.
“How much homework do you give? Is it even called ‘homework’ when it’s assigned at home?”
None. My kids are 5 and 7 and there is no need for homework at their age. They don’t need extra practice or help transferring their skills to their home. That doesn’t mean they don’t do any self-initiated schoolwork outside our school time. Right now my son is sitting with a book reading about space and stopping every few minutes to inform me of new facts he is learning.
“Do your students have to take the same standardized tests as mine? If so, how much test prep do you do each week?”
No, they don’t have to according to the laws here. I’ll probably start standardized tests around 3rd grade because it will give me measurable progress in comparison to peers. Test prep for pre-high school years will likely be minimal. By minimal I mean I may give them one practice test. I understand what you are referring to regarding test prep. I worked in the public schools in Texas. I don’t subscribe to the philosophy that I should incorporate test goals into my curriculum.
“And as homeschool teachers, aren’t you just as curious about the life of a public school teacher? If for anything else, to rethink and reshape your own teaching philosophies?”
I worked in different public schools for several years as a specialist. I worked with the teachers so I am familiar with the life. I am familiar with the ragging-on-homeschooling-talk that goes on in the teacher’s lounge.
I am in constant contact with teachers. I have learned a great deal talking with homeschool teachers regarding philosophies, methods, and styles. I don’t turn to public school teachers for advice. There are lots of great public school teachers out there, but their perspective isn’t toward individualizing education. Anyway, why would I go to them for advice when they don’t tend to respect homeschooling?
I’ll take them one by one:
1) Balancing teacher/parent: Misconception or a matter of semantics, I guess. A parent is a teacher from the time the child arrives. So I suppose it would be more helpful to define what good parenting is before defining what a good teacher is. As far as I’m concerned they are one in the same.
2) You buy a computer, tv, dvd player,(the former which you prolly already have), microscope, get a library card, network with local business owners, and build relationships with museums, parks, zoos, hospitals,etc. Depending on where you live – you’re welcome at the local schools for select classes.
3) teaching sub. I don’t know: We learn about them (homeschool parents pursue continuing education just like professional teachers) or we outsource – in various ways.
4) homework: depends, different families do it differently. Personally, in the lower grades, no, there was no after hours work. I gave each child a list of assignments that would take 2-3 hours ( unless they fiddled around) when they were done, they were done. In the older grades as the course work becomes more complex, then yes, there is after hours work. Math is split into two sessions, book analyses, thesis papers, science labs – are worked on through out the day and weekend – so it becomes somewhat like homework.
5) standardized testing: depends on where you live. The 50 states each have their own statutes concerning homeschool requirements. It runs the spectrum. Texas requires no reporting at all. New York requires quarterly reports as well as end of the year testing. However, many homeschool families do purchase and administer CATs or the like for their own peace of mind. Also, many families hire evaluators who interview and review the child’s work and make suggestions and give feedback to the parent/teacher.
The Best?: You’re home. You’re not at the mercy of an imposed calendar. You can get very creative in your lessons.
The Worst?: You’re home. You’re not at the mercy of an imposed calendar. You can get very creative in your lessons.
LOL! It’s matter of balance. There are a lot of distractions in the home so you need to become a good manager of time and make sure you get things done. You’re not given a calendar so you have to make your own. You can become too creative and spend too much time on stuff, or just spend too much time on field trips, co-ops and the like.
So a parent/teacher needs to know themselves well and get help when he/she needs it.
For example – I know myself well enough that if I didn’t buy a complete curriculum and did what’s called DIYC (do it yourself cur.) I would be too heavy on the stuff I like, science and math, and shy away from the stuff I don’t like, grammar. So I use a “canned” curriculum to keep myself honest and cover all subjects.
Does that answer your questions?
I am still a rookie homeschooler (we’re finishing our second year) but I’ll take a crack at your questions:
“How do you balance being both parent and teacher to your child?” – I’ve always considered myself my child’s educator – I helped her learn how to walk, talk, ride a bike, make her own breakfast, dress herself. Teaching reading, writing, and arithmetic flow out of that. I don’t really have trouble with the “balance” issue.
“How do you incorporate technology into your lessons?” – We’re in second grade here, so she’s learning some basic computer skills and she watches video that relate to subject matter. My husband is using a Lego robotics program to teach her about programming. When she’s older we’ll buy as many good supplies as we can afford and maybe borrow the rest.
“How do you go about teaching a subject you know very little about?” – We learn it together. We had a lot of fun learning Latin together this year.
“How much homework do you give?” – None. We work together and when she’s grasped a concept we move on. We review regularly to make sure she’s still got it, but there’s no need for me to assign her “busy work.” When she’s older she’ll have independent assignments to do, but I don’t really consider that homework. I call it learning to be responsible with an assigned task.
“Is it even called ‘homework’ when it’s assigned at home?” – See above.
“Do your students have to take the same standardized tests as mine?” Not in New Jersey, where I live. Requirements are different in each state. And even if a state requires testing, it usually allows parents a choice in what standardized test they use (IOWA, CAT, etc.)
“If so, how much test prep do you do each week?” None. We just have fun learning lots of good stuff.
This whole “public teacher vs. homeschool teacher” thing has only exploded on your blog because someone decided to write a post that was pretty incendiary to homeschoolers on your blog. They really kind of asked for it.
My two best friends are public school teachers. I went to public school. I know all about it. My friends are sending their kids to public school because they really believe in it. I’m homeschooling my kids because I really believe in that. We have our good-natured debates about the pros and cons of different schooling methods, but we know in the end that we both love our kids and want the best for them.
The posts on your blog implied that parents who homeschool do so to the detriment of their own children and society in general, and that we only do so because of our own selfish desires or because we fear the world. The homeschool parents who consistently sacrifice their time, energy, and money to give their children the best they can are naturally going to be defensive.
A honest discussion rather than a bunch of smack talk would be like a breath of fresh air.
How do you balance being both parent and teacher to your child? Some people, when they find out you homeschool, respond with “I could never teach my kids”, forgetting that they teach their kids all the time. For me the harder issue is balancing being a parent and teacher and defining yourself separately as an individual. With no paycheck or not much support from society, we have little positive reinforcement other than the success of our kids. Yet if we teach our kids correctly and set appropriate boundaries, then they are ultimately responsible for their own successes (and failures). So I have to determine internally who I am, what defines my success (rather than my children’s), and how I will grow in my profession and as a person. For me, this has been harder as a homeschool parent than as a working scientist who was also a parent.
How do you incorporate technology into your lessons? Right now, I am trying to decide how to take the technology out of our lessons. So many great on-line resources and classes.
How do you go about teaching a subject you know very little about? We hire a tutor for Spanish, take on-line classes, learn together (which makes me a part-time student, too).
How much homework do you give? None
Do your students have to take the same standardized tests as mine? No, although I did have my son take the EXPLORE through the Duke TIP program to get some idea of where he is in relation to other students (we just went to our state recognition ceremony last week, to give you an idea). And we do no test taking prep other than the short one provided on the EXPLORE website.
I think homeschoolers probably have a better idea about the life of public school teachers than vice versa. I have tremendous respect for most teachers (I might have said all if I hadn’t read the previous rant on homeschoolers.)
I love discussing education with anyone with a passion for it, and this often includes public school teachers. I love dissecting the purpose of what we teach our kids- should we emphasize a personal connection with a book when we teach reading or the academics of it- reading strategy, vocabulary, figurative language? Is the history of math or science as valid as, say, American history as a subject? Is it about the process of history or a discrete set of facts? For me, these are more interesting topics and get us beyond the current discussion of public school vs. homeschool to education in general.
I appreciate you reaching out for a broader discussion. I have children in both public school and homeschool, and I hate the yelling on both sides, too!
Very good to see someone who would like to share experiences rather than just attack us. More sharing of experiences can only benefit both sides of this issue. After all, we are all in the “business” of education children, and none of us knows everything.
Q) How do you balance being both parent and teacher to your child?
A) Every parent is also a teacher. It’s a natural part of the “job”. The only difference is that we prolong the combination, not choose to delegate the academics to an outside resource. There is no “balance” required. Both jobs are as natural as breathing.
Q) How do you incorporate technology into your lessons?
A) We use videos, DVD’s, CD’s, and computer-based curricula. Certainly my children know how to operate and make use of all these things. How can a child not learn these unless you live the life of the Amish? But, I don’t think this is really what you are asking.
Part of this question, I believe, comes from a misguided belief that kids must learn technology at an early age. Schools make such a big deal about pushing computer skills at an early age. Starting young children on computer skills is not proven to have any great advantages. By high school, certainly, kids can make good use of various computer applications, such as Word and Excel, and my older son will soon be learning these through on-line tutorials. A word-processor can be a huge help to a child who struggles with written work. However, see no value in teaching a 6yo to use a computer-based “drawing” program instead of letting him play with crayons, paints and pastels. I see no value in teaching an 8yo to let the computer do all his spelling and punctuation corrections instead of learning to proofread his own work. The many computer applications that are used in adult workplaces can easily be learned in a few hours with a tutorial. The supposed benefits of the use of technology do not come close to justifying the huge expense to the taxpayers of making our schools technologically “up-to-date”. (My husband is an IT professional, so we ARE familiar with the real-world needs and uses.)
Q) How do you go about teaching a subject you know very little about?
A) I read. I talk to others who have already traveled the same road. I research the many options in curriculum. I make use of outside options. I attend our state homeschool conference. Sometimes my child and I learn together.
As this seems to be the most appropriate spot for the following info, I’ll include it here. Our state convention is not just a few moms sitting around talking. This year’s convention consisted of 4 featured speakers, 26 workshop presenters, 100+ exhibitors, and more than 6,200 attendees. There are public school teachers that attend because it is better than the public school state conference. The exhibitors offer a wealth of curricula to research and explore, as well as a huge variety of “extras” that make our day more interesting.
Q) How much homework do you give?
A) As in many schools, it depends on whether or not the child completes his work in a timely manner. My child is not allowed to waste MY time, if he wastes his own, then he spends the extra time.
Q) Is it even called ‘homework’ when it’s assigned at home?
A) Not in my family. It’s “schoolwork” regardless of what time of day they are working on it.
Q) Do your students have to take the same standardized tests as mine?
A) It depends on the state laws. In our state, we are required to have them tested yearly, but the choice of test is entirely up to the parent.
Q) If so, how much test prep do you do each week?
A) None. I teach. The test serves as a way to see if we have any weakness that we need to focus on a bit more.
Q) And as homeschool teachers, aren’t you just as curious about the life of a public school teacher?
A) Sometimes. I wonder how on earth they can manage the crowd-control of a full classroom. I know that I do NOT envy them their job. I greatly admire the good teachers, they have a huge responsibility, and often have to deal with the worst aspects of the job. I get the fun side of the job, and I don’t have to deal with administrators or sometimes obnoxious parents.
Q) If for anything else, to rethink and reshape your own teaching philosophies?
A) These are always in flux. The needs of my children vary from year to year and from child to child. The underlying “philosophy”, however, does not change: I know my children best, I have their best-interests at heart, and I am best-suited to oversee their education, by whatever route we choose.
I am thankful that this is finally coming back into perspective-this post has brought some objectivity back to this blog.
It seems that some of you have had very positive experiences home-schooling which I commend you on your hard work.
I would also like to point out that home-schooling children for many is an issue of equity. The idea that you can stay home with your children is accessible to a small percentage of individuals. Public schools also need to be places that encourage learning and development-and I will be the first to admit that our public school system is far from perfect. However, for many working families it is the only option.
I would like to encourage all to continue participating in this discussion-it seems that there is quite a bit for all to learn here.
“I would also like to point out that home-schooling children for many is an issue of equity.”
I guess I don’t quite understand. Because not everyone can homeschool, no one should be allowed to? I can think of all sorts of things my family can’t afford to do (mostly because I don’t work so I can be a full-time homeschool Mom) but I don’t begrudge those things to people who can.
“The idea that you can stay home with your children is accessible to a small percentage of individuals.”
I disagree with your premise. I think homeschooling is available to many people (just as staying at home with young children is available) but many people don’t want to make the necessary adjustments to their lifestyles. We decided that raising our own children and educating them was more important than driving new cars or living in a big house or wearing certain clothes or golfing every weekend or getting my nails done or paying for a gym membership or eating out several times a week. But that’s us. We know and are related to several homeschool families that make due on very little to stay committed to their familes.
Granted, there are some people that really can’t (my Mom, for instance, had to work or we didn’t eat) but a lot of the people I know who whine about not being about to quit their jobs have enormous houses (and mortgages to match) and two new SUVs in the driveway. But then again, I live in New Jersey.
Erica-
I never said that no one should be allowed to home school. In fact, I think that it is a positive option that I commend you for.
Perhaps home-schooling is an option for those willing to adjust their lifestyles. It sounds as if your very own family at one point even fell into this category.
Lets take a 12-year old for example, who speaks better english than his/her parents. The parents may work 50-60 hours or more per week for minimum wage or even less to put food on the table, home schooling is not an option for this student. As a parent, you are going to want your kid to be able to go to college and get the best education possible to give them as many options in the future. I think it is a stretch to say that home-schooling would be right for this student.
So for me it is not about one over the other-It is about finding what is best for kids given there situation, and then providing them with tools and experiences that will help them have a better future.
I guess I don’t understand your comment about the equity issue then, since you seem to think it’s a legitimate option for some people and not the best choice for others. An opinion with which I would agree.
Where’s the issue of equity in that?
If you have a choice on whether you home school or not-
The example that I gave has no choice. That is the equity issue-it is about privilege and access in this case. It is not an option for this student. Does that make sense…
I guess so. Then again, if a situation is by definition “inequitable” because not everyone has the same “privilege and access” then I don’t really know of any situations in life that are “equitable.”
It may be something to strive for in a society, but I don’t think it can ever be fully reached because people are still allowed to make their own choices (good, bad, or just different) within the options available to them.
So while an issue can be made of laws that prevent people from having certain options available to them, if every option is “theoretically” available then it is simply a matter of working for what you want.
I would argue there is a homeschool option for the kid in the example you cited. By the age of 12, I would hope that a lot of learning is self-directed (it was for me at that point). But it’s a moot point if the kid doesn’t want to be homeschooled and the parents aren’t interested either.
My point is that all options should be available to parents (in the legal sense) and let people make the best decision they can for their family situation. That sounds pretty “equitable” to me.
I have to point out, gehry, that this is a common oversimplification WRT homeschoolers. I’ve homeschooled in two states, and have always known fellow homeschoolers who were living below the poverty line. Among my homeschooling friends, it’s more common to be living on one income that’s comparable to a teacher’s salary than not, and most of those families are supporting a minimum of five people. Certainly, there are many homeschoolers who can easily afford the choice, but to gloss over the number of people willing to scrimp, sacrifice, drive thirteen year old cars and never go on a family vacation in order to homeschool is to gloss over the real importance of homeschooling to public school teachers.
And I ask you: Do we not have many students in college who have minimal English skills? The fact is that my 11 year old can give himself a great education. (http://www.thecrimson.com/article.aspx?ref=132239) This is an old article, and not representative of the way we homeschool, but worth looking at, nonetheless.
Home schooling MAY not be the best option. Then, again, it might be the best option. Until you see the specific situation, you cannot actually say what the best option is. While I admire your point, it is still a generalization.
When I lived in D.C., we had several families in our homeschool group, the parents of which had minimal English language skills. That’s just part and parcel to the area of the country we lived in. However, just like those parents were able to help my children learn Spanish (as were the children), I was able to help the parents and their children perfect their English. These children did not spend all day cooped up inside. In fact, most of them had excellent English skills. And, because the parents had English speakers to help them find good curriculum for their children, and they could see whether a specific curriculum was frustrating their child or not, they were able to accomodate their children. And no, they weren’t rich.
“The Geeks vs. The Idiot”
So Jesse’s an idiot. (I’m assuming you’re calling us the geeks, as he did.) And you share this blog with him because…? Is it part of your shared philosophy that putting young children under the control of hateful or incompetent teachers is a positive experience?
“And as homeschool teachers, aren’t you just as curious about the life of a public school teacher? If for nothing else, to rethink and reshape your own teaching philosophies?”
As everyone has mentioned above, most of us have attended and/or worked in public schools. It is not a mystery to us. And we have access to the same education studies, journals and books you do — in fact, most homeschoolers are probably more knowledgeable about topics like learning styles than most public school teachers.
But the fact is that teaching in a public school (or most institutional school settings) is nothing like homeschooling. In school, the main goal is control and conformity. Take one of Jesse’s dysfunctional teachers and lock him/her in a room with one student for a year, and yes, I would be very afraid.
For a large number of homeschoolers it’s all about personalizing the experience to fit the individual. Focus on topics you enjoy; explore them in a way that is meaningful and positive for you. Together with your children, you can choose your own course of study and your own ways of evaluation, which can just be working alongside and talking to your kids to see how much they have absorbed. (In my state we have to give tests some years, but they play a very small part in my kids’ lives.)
Homeschoolers don’t have to worry about “meeting standards” or keeping a group of widely differing children under control. What does your classroom experience have to offer me? Very little that I can’t find out on my own.
This is actually a more constructive sort of dialog. And — I suspect, as a public school teacher who knows very little about homeschooling, you may be surprised to know that there are homeschoolers (or former homeschoolers, since my son graduated!) who actually know, have a positive relationship with, school teachers.
In fact, I have publicly spoken in a positive manner to other homeschoolers about this false antagonism. Some homeschoolers are ripped into by teachers — but I never have. Every teacher who has met my son and I has told me “good for you” when they found I homeschooled my son.
I have respect for some teachers, indifference to some, and a sincere hope that others will leave the profession.
The guidance department at the school we were zoned for, where my son took his assorted tests (PSAT, SAT, AP) was nothing but helpful and happy to have us for those exams. Working together in that manner for a positive outcome for the student(s) is ideal. Not what happens everywhere, but hopefully, if we all educate ourselves about both sides, perhaps it will become more common.
Now, on to your questions.
>As a public school teacher who knows very little about homechooling, I would love to know what it takes to be a good homeschool teacher. I have questions like, How do you balance being both parent and teacher to your child?
This IS a tricky thing, especially in the early days. My son was 10.5 when we began homeschooling him. We did have to find a balance point. And sometimes, it shifts, because children change, grow and develop and have different needs, and, quite honestly, parents, ideally, change, grow and develop. There was a huge learning curve for us, especially me, and I frequently had to change how we approached things.
>How do you incorporate technology into your lessons?
Initially, we didn’t use much technology. When my son was in public school, the teacher had urged us to get him MathBlasters, which he had fun with — but did very little math with. Seemed a waste of time, to us. Calculators were not used in math until Alg. 2/Trig, and then sparingly. When he did precalc., he was a dually enrolled student at a local math/science charter, and graphing calculators were required, so he started using it then. I had tutored a student in Alg. 2/Trig who I saw whip her calculator out for things like 3×4 — and I wanted to prevent that kind of mental laziness. (She was a public school student, btw.) So I felt strongly that too much reliance on technology was unwise.
That said, my son had fun “playing” with a computer program called Graphmatica. He also used various tools for creative endevours, creating stop-motion animation on the computer, that sort of thing. Later, he used a free game developer to help him there, though now that he has more powerful computer programming languages in his toolbelt, he has grown beyond Gamemaker. (He’s a college student, so that is natural.)
We tried using Rosetta Stone for French (the language he picked) — but he didn’t use it much. I felt it wasn’t worth ruining our relationship over, as there are colleges that don’t require a language. Irony coming up later…
> How do you go about teaching a subject you know very little about?
We found resources, sometimes outsourced entirely (we used an online writing tutor for, well, writing), books, websites. I learned history along side my son — a subject I wasn’t keen on when I was in school, but found far more fascinating the second go-around. My son enjoyed it (not his main strength or focus), so at least he was spared the approach that killed it for me. We used thinkwell (and a test-prep book) to prepare him for the American Government and Politics AP exam — and despite our not using the program to the best advantage (started late in the year, and since we were doing it with another homeschooler on the other end of town, we just got together once a week, and they did a mega-session — then had to cram at the end to cover all the material.) he still managed to get a score that gained him the credit for college.
There are a wide variety of options for homeschoolers to learn. And, in fact, my son continues to self-educate in a number of non-academic topics (though there are very academic connections on occasion) — he has been teaching himself guitar, mostly using the internet, though at college, he has spent time between classes with another student who is majoring in music, with a guitar focus, and has gotten pointers there. He also has taught himself to use a CAD program to design a twisty puzzle (think Rubik’s cube variations.)
As for French — when he wanted to apply to a school that required 2 years of a language, and he didn’t have it, we found a tutor who basically tutored the equivalent of French 101 in 6 weeks, my son took the placement test and placed in 102, and took that. When I mentioned that what he had done was the equivalent of 2 years of high school French, he said that if he had learned it at that pace, he wouldn’t have learned it very well. Some children truly cannot learn things as well at a slower pace. Ironically, the school he took French for (and did get accepted, btw) was out of reach financially, so he is in our local university, but has chosen to continue taking French, just for the fun of it.
>How much homework do you give? Is it even called ‘homework’ when it’s assigned at home?
We never called anything “homework” (other than what he was assigned by teachers while he was dually enrolled), but he did have some assignments to do. How much? I didn’t base it on time spent, but on understanding and mastery. I tried to assign a reasonable amount of relevant material, so that he would be able to demonstrate understanding of the material. Occasionally, if it was interesting to him, he went beyond the basics that we were formally covering. We detoured on occasion, to follow interesting paths, because learning should be a journey of delight, not an obligation of drudgery. As a result, in addition to the basics, my son has an eclectic assortment of odd facts.
> Do your students have to take the same standardized tests as mine? If so, how much test prep do you do each week? In short, I want to know your best (and worst) practices.
Depends on what tests yours take…
Some homeschoolers take annual standardized tests. We did not. My son did take the usual college-prep tests, though, including a couple SAT-II subject tests (physics and Math-2), as well as 5 AP exams. And the local university requires homeschoolers to take the COMPASS exam, which is actually kind of silly. It took very little time for my son, far less than the SAT, but covered the same broad topics of reading, writing and math. It also mirrored exactly the results — strongest in math and reading, fine in writing, but not as strong.
>And as homeschool teachers, aren’t you just as curious about the life of a public school teacher? If for nothing else, to rethink and reshape your own teaching philosophies?
Actually, I have some friends who ARE teachers, one in private, the other in public. And I have actually substitute taught in the private school my son formerly attended, and before that, planned and taught a once-a-week science class for 2-5th graders. (Much harder than homeschooling, as I had such a wide array of ability levels to meet.) I did it by researching the topic needed (and I was the primary science source, as it turned out), developing hands-on activities, and started out by introducing what we were learning about, what the procedure for the day was, and then wrapping up in the end.
And, as it turns out, I would be able to pass the Florida Teachers Competency Exam, were I able to take it, despite not having taken all those education classes. I borrowed a book from the library that was designed to be a study guide, and took one of the sample tests without reading the book first. I got a 76% — then looked to find out what a passing score is. 56%. And when a passing score is achieved, no number is sent, just a PASS — one only gets the numerical score if they fail.
But homeschoolers tend to read voraciously, all sorts of things, on education, learning styles, resources… and yes, do reshape their teaching approaches. In fact, my approach seemed to change on a regular basis.
My fantasy is a public school system totally revamped, to the point where it would be unrecognizable by current standards. It would be available for as much or as little as each family needed for each student (and since I have known many homeschooling families that don’t homeschool each child, as they have different needs, it isn’t a given that it will be the same for each), a resource center, a place adults could learn, too (how many adults realize that they never learned the things that NOW they need, when they were in high school?), or where parents could ask questions for clarification or guidance. Maybe a lab resource… that is one thing that is harder to do at home, as some of the lab equipment is too expensive for home use.
I have never been antagonistic towards teachers in general. I realize that many truly care. But really, is trying to meet 20+ children’s needs, with several different learning styles, some of which are totally at odds with one another, in a group setting ideal? Of course not. There are many other possible ways one could set up the schools, that would meet a greater number of children’s needs.
I would like to see us all work together — because I think that public and private school teachers could learn a lot from the successes of homeschoolers, and that homeschoolers should realize that teachers know a couple things, too.
“My fantasy is a public school system totally revamped, to the point where it would be unrecognizable by current standards. It would be available for as much or as little as each family needed for each student (and since I have known many homeschooling families that don’t homeschool each child, as they have different needs, it isn’t a given that it will be the same for each), a resource center, a place adults could learn, too (how many adults realize that they never learned the things that NOW they need, when they were in high school?), or where parents could ask questions for clarification or guidance. Maybe a lab resource… that is one thing that is harder to do at home, as some of the lab equipment is too expensive for home use.”
Yes, exactly! Well said!
I like it! Especially considering that everyone pays taxes for the school system – whether their children are in the system or not (or even if they don’t have children).
A truly “equal access” system would not be an “all or nothing.” “one size fits all” venture.
How do you balance being both parent and teacher to your child?
A as a homeschooling parent we quickly come to realize that the two roles aren’t mutually exclusive since parents are *always* teaching their children; It’s just that most parents don’t realize this is happening. If this weren’t the case, we’d never learn how to speak.
Homeschooling parents just turn it up a notch or two and incorporate life lessons and school lessons together.
How do you incorporate technology into your lessons?
It’s an age thing and my kids are raised by nerds, so they have had some form of technology in their hands since birth.
How do you go about teaching a subject you know very little about?
Research, research, research and go to experts in the field. I have a kid who wanted to know more about CSI so we got a retired FBI agent to put a class together with a bunch of other kids who wanted to know more as well. They key is pooling resources and research, research, research.
How much homework do you give? Is it even called ‘homework’ when it’s assigned at home?
LOL! Well, homework implies work to do at home beyond what *should* have been done in the classroom. So, no, no homework per quo but then again, we are constantly in a learning mode.
Do your students have to take the same standardized tests as mine? If so, how much test prep do you do each week? In short, I want to know your best (and worst) practices.
Here in VA, we have to take standardized tests but we don’t ‘teach to the test’ as many schools do since we aren’t bound by any ‘no child left behind’
nonsense and my children usually test into the 90-95%.
And as homeschool teachers, aren’t you just as curious about the life of a public school teacher? If for nothing else, to rethink and reshape your own teaching philosophies?
Both of my in-laws are retired, card-carrying union Public School teachers who strongly support homeschooling.
Last month, I had an interesting experience when my aunt, a high school public school teacher, came to visit for a week. She got a chance to see us in action and was really intrigued.
She saw how learning does not fit in a box for our children. How the spirit of curiosity can possess them at any moment. How our daughter will choose, of her own accord, to dive into a string of math problems at eight o’clock at night on a Saturday for fun.
She got to attend the annual planning meeting for our large secular homeschooling group where we discussed what activities, classes, workshops and field trips different parents wanted to offer our children of all ages, across all disciplines in the coming school year. She was blown away by the spirit of cooperation and the commitment to education she witnessed in that room. She was also amazed at the concrete grasp of the challenges she faces as a public school teacher within the system this eclectic collection of home educating parents had when she spoke with them.
We had many long conversations about the state of education in this country. Everything she shared with me about how difficult it is to be a public school teacher these days, I was already well aware of, but she left my home with a whole new, much more accurate understanding of the mosaic that is American homeschooling than she ever had before.
Many of us have already put countless hours in to researching and learning about life in the public school system. We did that when trying to decide what educational path to follow for our children. Many of us also keep up with the latest in proposed public school and educational reforms because the field of education is one about which, we feel very strongly.
I appreciate your respectful desire to learn more about modern home education. I hope it benefits you in some way to do so and I wish more public school educators would follow this example. I understand that there are many dedicated educators struggling to fight the good fight from within the belly of the beast of the institutional system on behalf of their students. I just wish they didn’t think homeschoolers were the ill-informed enemy.
What does it take to be a good homeschool teacher? One would have to define “good homeschool teacher”, which is just as complex as “good school teacher”. In my house, I consider the key to be unwavering dedication. And when the dedication DOES waver, I rely on the fact that I am a good parent.
Balancing parenting and teaching isn’t always easy, but it can be made simpler by meshing the two roles instead of seeking equal weight. Cut a person in half, and you have two halves of a useless body.
Technology? While my children are still young (all under 11), they can work a computer (or video game, or DVR, or just about anything else with a button) better than I can. Technology is a regular part of our lives, so it’s a regular part of our learning. To be fair, my toddler only prefers Firefox to Internet Explorer because Firefox has a star right on the URL box.
As we’ve only reached the 5th grade (6th in math) in our house, there hasn’t been much to struggle with. I assure you that I fully intend to outsource Calculus, as that was my worst subject in school. Thank goodness for the internet, teacher manuals, private tutors, and community colleges.
We don’t use the term homework because it’s redundant. We do as much work as needed.
Testing requirements vary by state. My state requires standardized testing in certain grades. We do not do much test prep at all, and the prepping we do is only to familiarize them with the format. I’ve never really understood the concept of test prep, and what it actually measures. Aren’t students expected to learn these things through regular lessons?
Personally, I don’t find much to be curious about in the life of a public school teacher. I’m closely related to half a dozen and more distantly related to more than twice that many. In my experience, the newer teachers disapprove of my choice, while the old timers are not only accepting, but encouraging. I’ve gone through public school (my husband through private). There’s no mystery to uncover.
How do you balance being both parent and teacher to your child?
Moms teach. Even moms whose children are in school teach. I just teach more stuff.
How do you incorporate technology into your lessons?
It depends on the lesson. I don’t know that it’s necessary to incorporate technology into everything. If we’re doing research projects, there is of course the Internet. If we’re sewing, there are sewing machines. OTOH, if we’re talking about the reasons the levees failed during Katrina, you can’t beat sandcastles at the beach.
How do you go about teaching a subject you know very little about?
Sometimes we learn together, sometimes I find someone who knows the subject. Sometimes the kids teach themselves, as my daughter is doing now with her all-consuming interest in cartooning. Education is not necessarily unidirectional.
How much homework do you give? Is it even called ‘homework’ when it’s assigned at home? LOL! It’s all homework when you homeschool.
No, seriously, in this house “homework” is the term used for the boring-but-necessary repetitive stuff, like handwriting practice. I try to keep it to a minimum, but it does exist.
Do your students have to take the same standardized tests as mine? Our state offers the option of standardized testing or portfolio review. As a matter of principle, I opt for portfolio review. Testing is great when you have so many kids to teach you can’t be certain exactly what each child knows, or when you’re accountable to prove to someone else that s/he knows it. With only two students, I don’t have to test to know if they can do square roots, or spell “Mississippi”.
If so, how much test prep do you do each week? In short, I want to know your best (and worst) practices. We do things until they can do them correctly without thinking about the process. Then we go on to other things.
And as homeschool teachers, aren’t you just as curious about the life of a public school teacher? If for nothing else, to rethink and reshape your own teaching philosophies?
Honestly? Not so much. My own teaching philosophies are formed by my experiences and by my children, not by trends or fashions or whatever is the latest theory embraced by the county school system. That having been said, do I borrow from other people? Yes, and some of those other people are public school teachers, though admittedly they tend to be the “outlaw” teachers, the ones whose principals throw up their hands in despair (the ones who are either beloved or loathed by former parents). Another few are private school teachers, and others are my fellow homeschooling parents. A few are non-teachers, non-parents, folks who simply are good at explaining and showing. I borrow from all of them because they’re people I respect, not because they fall into a neatly defined professional category. If they fall into any category at all, it would be “original thinkers”, because that is what I hope my children will be.
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Thank you for asking so nicely. I’m happy to answer your questions without fear of repeating since homeschooling is so different for each student and each homeschooling family.
“As a public school teacher who knows very little about homechooling, I would love to know what it takes to be a good homeschool teacher. I have questions like, How do you balance being both parent and teacher to your child?”
The short answer is that I’m mostly the parent. My boys didn’t come home until middle school and they chose to be self-educators. I choose curriculum, supervise lessons and assess how well things are going. I think I’m more the principal than the teacher.
“How do you incorporate technology into your lessons?”
Most of their classes are virtual, so incorporating technology has never been an issue. We’ve done projects as written essays, powerpoint slide shows, demonstrations, etc. etc.
“How do you go about teaching a subject you know very little about?”
*I* don’t! I find someone who can. We’ve used community college classes, virtual high school and college classes (check out MIT OpenCourseWare for lots of cool stuff), correspondence courses, taking courses at the local high school, and hiring a native Chinese speaker as a tutor for my son who wanted to learn Mandarin.
“How much homework do you give? Is it even called ‘homework’ when it’s assigned at home?”
We just call it schoolwork. Since my boys are teens, they do most of their bookwork on their own. I do “teach” literature, through sharing books and discussion. I’ve trained as a teacher and am a published author so I know what I’m talking about. But just in case you don’t believe me, my lit class has been reviewed by our virtual school and appropriate credit awarded. My youngest son just scored in the 8th stanine on his DRP (Degrees of Reading Power) test.
“Do your students have to take the same standardized tests as mine?”
Yes. They’ve taken the state NCLB test through 8th grade, the EXPLORE and the ACT. Last year, my then 8th grader scored a 25 composite on the ACT. (That’s 1130-1160 out of 1600 on the SAT.)
“If so, how much test prep do you do each week?”
None.
“In short, I want to know your best (and worst) practices.”
I have found that the current buzzwords “differentiation” and “project-based learning” are exactly what homeschool teachers are doing at their kitchen tables every day. We may call “cross-curricular studies” “unit studies,” but they are still as viable a best practice when the homeschool co-op uses them as when an elementary school uses them.
Home schoolers also have the luxury to change things when they aren’t working. When we realized the second semester reading curriculum we ordered for 6th grade was just a repeat of the first semester (with different book excerpts), we tossed it and did our own thing.
My worst practice is saying “Yes” to every opportunity that comes our way. And my husband says I should be riding them harder. But I know my 15yo is not emotionally ready to go away to college, so I’m not in a hurry to get him through his high school credits and graduate him.
“And as homeschool teachers, aren’t you just as curious about the life of a public school teacher? If for nothing else, to rethink and reshape your own teaching philosophies?”
I was a public school teacher long enough to know that I’m *terrible* at it. I love to teach and to learn but I can’t do the crowd control to save my life. That doesn’t mean I don’t subscribe to EdWeek and Teacher Magazine, read about educational theories or attend conferences. You will find that home schoolers are passionate about researching curricula, sharing ideas and attending home schooling conferences. We get as much–or maybe more–professional development than professional teachers.
How do you balance being both parent and teacher to your child? What is there to balance? Teaching and parenting are the same process. Guiding your child through academic subjects doesn’t really take a different skill than guiding your child through potty training, dressing themselves, dealing with friends, etc.
How do you incorporate technology into your lessons? We use the computer everyday. They research topics and look up book reviews (and occasionally write) on the internet. They go online to order and renew books from the library. They keep track of books read in goodreads. They play online games and computer games to supplement what they study. We have several curriculum that are computer based and next year, we start a dvd lesson. My nine-year old daughter has a blog about our nature studies. She takes pictures, edits them, and posts them on her blog. She is now helping my mother start a blog. Both kids have friends and family members that they email. They often chat with those friends to work out a problems in math or discuss books they are both reading. They type most of their assignments and save them. They use Excel spreadsheets when needed. We have presentations that we give to our homeschool group and they make power point slide shows. They have made and edited video presentations. They use the dvr to record educational shows that we want to see at our convenience. They load audio books to their mp3 players. Next year, my son is taking a class to learn how to run the sound system at church.
How do you go about teaching a subject you know very little about? You know, I never changed a diaper before I had a child and I managed to learn that as well as potty training and several other aspects of parenting. To be honest, there is not a subject that I don’t feel comfortable with, especially in grade school and middle school. Well, there’s guitar and we outsource that. Next year, I am using a video writing curriculum. I am confident that I could do it myself just a well but I just love this curriculum LOL. I spend a good deal of time reading and researching various teaching methods and curriculums. I belong to a couple message boards to where I can post a question and get a quick reponse and friends who are experts in almost any field. I plan to have my kids dually enroll for math and science when they get into high school.
How much homework do you give? Is it even called ‘homework’ when it’s assigned at home?
We don’t have homework in the same sense as you. I meet with my children in the morning and discuss what needs to be done that day. If it doesn’t get done due to their goofing off or procrasting, then they have “homework”. Homeschooling is more efficient than tradtional schooling and I can get twice as much done in half the time as a typical school. I know this because up until 3 months ago, I had one in traditional school and one being homeschooled.
Do your students have to take the same standardized tests as mine? If so, how much test prep do you do each week?
Yes. It’s required by our state law. I don’t know what test you took. We took the ITBS. My son scored higher than my daughter did when she took the same test in government school. I spent less than five minutes on test prep, only taking time to show him how to fill in a bubble and have him sharpen some pencils before we went to test site. I don’t worry about meeting standards because we mostly surpass the standards. When I do my yearly lesson plans, I do pull up their grade levels and the one above and make sure we are covered. Right now, I am having to backtrack my daughter because her teacher didn’t teach anything that was not on the EOG test.
You are more than welcome to get a feel for what I do by visiting my blog. Or you can email me and I can send you a complete list of how I teach any (or each) subject and my plans for the future in those subjects. It’s much too long to post here.
In short, I want to know your best (and worst) practices.
Best practices: Living books that inspire for all subjects, chronological history, nature studies, narration, dictation, copywork, project based learning in child’s area of interest, dialectic discussions, learning set at child’s level whether ahead or behind, ability to adjust schedule if they don’t grasp something or already have a firm grasp, no busy work, lots of field trips, stopping everything to work on character,
Worst Practices: Homeschooling tends to be clutter attracting. Projects, books, papers everywhere. I tend to go through periods of overscheduling. I can not seem to get the parents of traditionally schooled kids to realize that just because we are home, doesn’t mean send your kid over to play at 10:00 AM when tracked out (first day of the week, I can forgive but everyday?) and that I will send my kids out when they are done so don’t come back at 10:05, 10:10, 10:15.
And as homeschool teachers, aren’t you just as curious about the life of a public school teacher? If for nothing else, to rethink and reshape your own teaching philosophies?
Not anymore. I went to a government school for 12 years. I have several teachers and former teachers in my family and circle of friends and listen to them complain all.the.time. I am certified as a substitute and have done that in the past. I volunteered in the schools almost daily while my kids attended.
I have read so many books on educational theories: Charlotte Mason’s books and books about Charlotte Mason’s methods, Well Trained Mind, Whole Hearted Child, Thomas Jefferson Education, books by John Holt, books by John Gatto, Genius Denied, as well as everything I can get on my son’s special needs. I regularly read and contribute to two message boards (WTM, Afterschoolers.yuku), several yahoo groups, and blogs.
I just wanted to add to that homeschooling isn’t always a choice. My 2E child was enrolled first in a private school and then in a public school. I was told by both that I should homeschool because neither school could meet his needs. While it hurt to hear it, I appreciated their candor. So, homeschooling was not a choice for my family, but a necessity.
And I did spend several years and countless hours volunteering and trying to improve the system for kids like mine. I admitted defeat when my son came home from school everyday, sat in my closet, and cried. I couldn’t sacrifice my son to try to save others.
Here, Here! I took that long, and painful, advocacy route. It’s disheartening to stay on that road when you look into the history in your school district, and realize that parents have been advocating for years without much to show for it.
I don’t know if the folks that write books and blogs and such encouraging parents to advocate understand what parents are up against. Homeschooling is much easier and less stressful.
Instead of being worried about how we do it, why not focus on the results instead? Does it matter “how” we teach the subject or does it matter that the student learns it?
Homeschoolers are often very familiar with how public schools work because many of them graduated from it. Many didn’t even start homeschooling until their child was in public school for a few years but found it was not meeting their child’s needs.
I homeschool and have friends that teach both public and private school. We all are of the opinion that parents should be able to choose what option is best for their family.
So no, I don’t need to learn more about the other side, I just need to know that my child is learning in whatever environment I choose to send them.
It’s a little late to make the case that we should not be competing against each other after an article appeared on this blog titled “The Case Against Homeschooling.” It was that article that seemed to set the tone in the first place and it wasn’t a pleasant one.
I appreciate your curosity about homeschoolers and their parents. I have a tremendous amount of teachers and counselors and principals in my family however I have chosen to educate my children at home. They learn not only the basics, language arts, history, science, math, bible, it includes how all of these apply and how they are used in everyday life. I never learned that in public school. Biology, well, our garden full of toads, snakes, birds, crickets, take a back seat to dissecting dead frogs. No we do not dissect live animals, however watching them in their “real” habitat is quite an adventure. Learning what a seed does and not only knowing what it will become but what it does in the process of growing is awesome. A 3-4′ plant comes from a seed no bigger than the end of a pencil. Where’s the math. How far apart do the seeds need to be planted in a 50 x 25 space, english, hey, talk about researching companion planting, this is not only historical but scientific and mathematical, and who provided all of the necessary components well that a God thing.
“Instead of being worried about how we do it, why not focus on the results instead? Does it matter “how” we teach the subject or does it matter that the student learns it?”
I think it does matter that we educate public and private school teachers on “how” we home school. I didn’t get the impression he was asking us to justify ourselves but rather trying to find the common ground. Since we are in a position to help traditional educators see that individualized learning does work best, why would we not do that?
Alistair,
I appreciate your open minded approach, and invite you to visit my blog, On Living By Learning at http://spedr.com/bobo
To address your questions:
I’m homeschooling a bright 3rd Grader who loves to read and learn. Frankly, I don’t have to do much to “teach” him. I just provide the materials, a little direction, and help when he needs it. It’s 3rd Grade, not rocket science.
Somehow, between my graduate degree in International Affairs from Columbia, and my husband’s medical doctorate, we manage to answer his questions. When I don’t know the answers, I ask qualified friends, or I do the research.
Of course, it helps that my daughter attended K-5 at the public school. I volunteered, observed, and kept much of the material that she used so I have that as a point of reference. My son also attended that school K-1, so I have the inputs from those amazing PS teachers.
I also read, a lot, about education theory, and was very impressed by Lucy Calkins and the writer’s workshop model. Also, I was impressed by the Renzulli Schoolwide Enrichment Model. Both are attempted at our public school, but not well.
I don’t know if I’m a good homeschool teacher, but my son is a curious, avid learner. You can see how he is doing on his own blog: http://spedr.com/4y597
How do I balance being a parent and teacher?
Well, I’ve always been a teacher to my children, since long before they entered formal schooling. Even when they were in PS, the kids did much of their learning at home, through reading, enrichment, and supplemental education. Most of that was under my guidance.
Incorporating technology into our lessons is another reason that I homeschool. I’ve written quite a bit on this topic:
See Is Your Child Computer Literate? http://spedr.com/2av2t for a description of our public school technology experience.
and
Home Schooling The Networked Student Series:
* Home Schooling The Networked Student
* How To Set Up Your Child’s New Computer
* Selecting A Browser For Your Child’s Computer
(See links at end of this post http://spedr.com/2p0c1)
Or, you can look at my son’s blog, especially recent posts in which he used YouTube, Powerpoint, and Slideshare to share poetry lessons.
Homework is fairly unnecessary in our situation, except in those cases where it helps with cognitive retention to have reinforcement of material at various timed intervals. Sometimes, we use homework for spelling or math facts. And, yes, it’s called homework.
We’re in NY, so we’re required to administer the assessment tests. I think we can postpone it until 5th Grade, but I’m having my son take them for various reasons. He took the SCAT to qualify for Gifted Programs from Johns Hopkins. Earlier in the year, we downloaded last year’s NY State Tests, and he took that so I could determine if he was on track. This week, he’s taking the CAT and the PASS. This is overkill, but I wanted to check out the differences between the tests so we can make informed decisions for the future. In the future, he’ll just take whichever one we determine fulfills NY requirements, and also gives us worthwhile feedback.
Test Prep – My son completed a workbook on analogies as part of his vocabulary curriculum. This had the added benefit of preparing him for the SCAT. He spent 10 minutes daily for a few weeks.
Last week, he worked through some of the material in the CAT prep book on a couple of days.
Frankly, nothing prepares a student for taking a standardized test except to actually take a test. Of course, this only works when they’re reading and learning steadily.
My 7th Grade daughter (who attends private school now) did quite well on the SAT this year. She prepped by taking a few practice tests (a couple of Saturday mornings,) but again this reflects a lot of reading and learning in her daily life.
I’m very curious about public school teachers. I follow several who write blogs and/or twitter. See this list of 100 Influential Blogs for Educators http://spedr.com/5p18a
Some of my faves: education.com, ReadWriteWeb, Joanne Jacobs, and Cool Cat.
I hope I’ve answered your questions, but I’d welcome any more on or offline. It’s quite interesting, and possibly enlightening, to have this exchange.
Hey all,
Thank-you for your thoughtful responses to my questions. I enjoyed reading through them all, even those who still couldn’t resist taking a swipe at public schools. It seems many of you have faced a great deal of criticism over the years (from family members, friends, public school teachers, etc), so I understand the frustration—especially in light of my friend’s posts over the weekend. Anyway, this is all just to say I learned a lot about homeschooling today. And I agree that homeschooling is absolutely the best choice for some children. On that note, if I could add another question to my previous batch, it would be, How do you determine if homeschooling is the best choice for your child? What are the determining factors?
I also feel as if I must address some of the misconceptions about public schools. Yes, public schools are messed up. We can blame that on the government, bad administrators, bad teachers, the union, lack of funds, standardized testing, NCLB—pick your poison. If you read the other posts on this blog, many of them are written by public school teachers who are examining the ways in which our system is failing its students. But does that mean I don’t believe in public education? Absolutely not. Every child in this country should have the option of a free education. The majority of my students don’t have parents to homeschool them even if that was the best choice for them. They are in the prison system or living in another country or “out of the picture” or dead. Others, as Gehry points out in his comment, didn’t graduate high school themselves and work 60 hours a week cleaning motel rooms for minimum wage. I’m not saying this is the only argument for public school education, but it’s certainly an important one.
And as for public school teachers—I must say I was a little disappointed in the lack of reciprocal curiosity about our practices (in some of the responses). I understand many of you attended public school, or have friends and family members who are teachers. But just as no homeschooling family is alike, no public school is alike either. I can tell you that the public school I attended in Michigan (which, I think, did a fine job) is nothing like the school I teach at now in the Bay Area. My co-workers (specifically those who I collaborate with on a daily basis) are the most exciting, hardworking, inspired people I have EVER known. I would go so far as to call them revolutionary—especially given the general lack of administrative support and chaos they must contend with every day. They would have to be some kind of Cesar Chavez to not lose heart in this mess. But that is life at an urban public school—a lot of chaos and negativity. Despite this, these teachers actively and energetically seek to empower young people by challenging them to resist the stereotypes and temptations that make it so easy to fall through the cracks, to fight back against any and all oppressors (in whatever form those oppressors may take), and to identify as “smart” or “college material” despite the abundance of voices (at home, in the media, on the street) telling them otherwise. Oh yeah—and they teach English and Math.
Ok—I suppose that’s enough for now. Thank-you again for all your responses. This is much more in the spirit of learning and understanding.
“How do you determine if homeschooling is the best choice for your child? What are the determining factors?”
I think it depends quite a bit on the parent. I would say it would be the best choice for most kids. However, in order for it to work properly you need a parent who has the time and desire to educate their child. For me it takes more than 8 hours a day in schooling, researching, collaborating, and planning. I design my own curriculum for the most part and I have children that do not fit into a classroom friendly learning style so it may take me more time than others.
The determining factors for me were:
- I can personalize my child’s curriculum to his level, his interests, and what I want him to learn about the world.
- I love teaching my children. I love spending time with them.
- My children have the opportunity to learn 4 languages and receive in depth exposure to cultures around the world.
- If my child is behind in a subject we can spend more time on it. If my child is ahead in a subject we can go forward as quickly as my child desires. For instance my 7 year old did Kindergarten level Handwriting earlier this year and is doing 4th grade level science and reading.
- I don’t want my child indoctrinated with the world view presented by public schooling. I don’t want my child schooling in the bully/catty/self-confidence draining social environment of public schools.
- Religion. I have no problem with my child learning about evolution or different religions, but through the perspectives of my beliefs and not through the perspective given in public schools.
How do you determine if homeschooling is the best choice for your child? What are the determining factors?
We started homeschooling my youngest first. He has Aspersers. We tried the IEP route every year for three years only to be turned down because of his academic achievement was too high. Then we were accused of not caring about our child because we didn’t have an IEP by same person who said NO three times before! They would promise things like social skills class and then not follow through but not tell me they were not doing it. My son was being bullied and ostracized without any teacher interference. I witnessed it and other parents who volunteered in school witnessed it and reported it to me. The social environment was 70% gangster kids (yes in second grade). For a child with a social disability, this was not the place for him to learn socialization. Academically, they did nothing with him. He passed the reading test for our district the first week of first grade and never got assessed or taught reading after that. His second grade teacher never heard him read once, never assigned him a book, discussed a book with him, assessed him or anything. She just let him read whatever he had with him. However, she gave him a 3 (instead of 3* or 4) in reading. I was told it was because he only read fantasy books in class (all the Dahl, Narnia, Eragon, Harry Potter books). The reality is she just wanted to show improvement and gave him a 4 on the last quarter. They would not subject accelerate him even though he had multiplication down in kindergarten. They would differentiate which was extra work after the other work was complete. Anytime, he missed a problem on anything I would get notified that he made a mistake. I was told by an Aide that worked there that we were the hot topic of conversation in the teacher’s lounge because I “thought my son was so smart”. He did not want to go to school at all. After we pulled him and left his sister in, he would still have panic attacks if he had to go in the building with me. Homeschooling is working for him. Every single naysayer that we had when started has come to us and apologized because they cannot believe how much this child has improved. He stands tall and looks adults in the eye. He can now eat properly and is less likely to run away and hide when something bad happens. Academically, he has soared. After 9 months of homeschooling him, we brought my daughter home. She had wanted to stay originally just to socialize with her friends but soon realized that she had more in common with our homeschool co-op friends (as she did things with us on weekends, teacher workdays, etc.) because the girls in the school were starting the mean girl behavior that tends to be typical in junior high. It started in third grade but was markedly more extreme in fourth grade. She was becoming catty, manipulative, materialistic, gossipy, always negative, etc. She was in AG math and could never learn math via the new math. I had to reteach her everything at home for her whole of her schooling. This child always hated reading until summers and then she would love it again. The one year that I did not supplement her at home (due to family emergency and trusting that her having the “best” teacher in the school), she made zero progress. She read at same level, did not learn a single new math skill, etc. Only changes were the negative behaviors. She’s only been home two months and has made amazing progress academically and socially. She has made drastic improvements in her self-concept, self-esteem and self-confidence.
Every child in this country should have the option of a free education.
First of all no one gets a “free” education. There is nothing that is free that we get from the government. We pay for it with taxes that we are forced to hand over with any say on whether we get a good or bad school (especially in my large district that utilizing busing to “equalize”). I can’t even request a particular teacher. We deserve choice. Yes, there are some good schools and teachers out there and they seem to be few and far between. What is “good” is also in the eye of the beholder. The absolute worse teacher we ever had was highly recommended to me by the PTA president. She thinks that teacher is awesome (despite that her daughter failed the next grade because she was unprepared by this teacher). I and several other parents thought the teacher was on drugs and should be fired.
And as for public school teachers—I must say I was a little disappointed in the lack of reciprocal curiosity about our practices (in some of the responses).
** What exactly is there to be curious about? We all know what teachers do as most of went to traditional school and had 40+ teachers in our lives. It’s kind of hard not to have at least one teacher/former teacher in your regular life paths (a family member, neighbor, church member, a great deal of your fellow homeschooling parents). Many of had kids in school before we homeschooled them. The media is full of movies about great teachers (which I noted the other week is overly male dominated) and most of those great teachers end up getting kicked out of the system by the status quo beaurocrats). There are tons of books featuring teachers. The NEA constantly fills the news with stories about how horrible everything is for teachers. It’s kind hard to not know anything about what teachers do. It doesn’t matter how great a teacher in Idaho is, if I am living in North Carolina.
Given that I’m available to homeschool both of my children, and both are bright, self-motivated learners, why am I only homeschooling one child?
Timing. Special Needs.
It never occurred to me to homeschool my older child. Instead, I spent many years working within the public school system, advocating for Gifted Ed programs. That was also when I started researching education, and comparing our schools to that of friends around the country.
By the time my son was in 1st Grade, I had a very good idea about what was available in our school district vs. that of other schools in Betheda, MD, southern, CA, and Westchester, NY. In our school, there is no Gifted Ed below 3rd Grade, and differentiation is not a panacea.
The timing was right to pull my son out of public school at the end of 1st Grade, before the frustrations set in. As bright as he is, and as articulate as he can be, his writing skills are relatively poor. He just can’t handwrite what he can say. This is where one-on-one assistance has been invaluable. He works on his writing skills, but we also use technology (including dictation) to let him express his thoughts.
With my daughter, we missed the window of opportunity to pull her out for homeschooling. She is enmeshed in the school culture. However, she is happy and thriving in her current school, a small alternative school that encourages creativity and project-based learning.
Both kids are in the right place for each right now. And, I’d say the determining factors are whether, or not, they are in a situation where they are engaged learners.
If there is one thing I’ve learned, it is that everything can change quickly. We can only make the right choice in the moment, and we’ll deal with the future when we get there.
Oh, and by the way, I do continue to learn from teachers in various settings. In addition to the teachers I follow online, I still visit school websites, and I question friends who are teachers. I learn from my daughter’s teachers. And, I still compare what my children’s friends are doing when we visit them in MD, FL, and CA.
Hey, what can I say, we’re a curious bunch!
gehry, based on your comment above, you and I are on the same page WRT the challenges facing the public school system, and the importance of that same system. I believe strongly in the *right* to a free public education, and in the importance of the job teachers do. However, the tone Jesse took this weekend was emblematic of an attitude that troubles me greatly. A right is not the same as an obligation. I’m not required to perpetuate the system in its current form just so Jesse won’t be pissed off.
I knew homeschooling was right for my family when I realized that sending my children to public school was going to exponentially increase my stress level, because not only would I be advocating for change in my own classroom and building, I’d have to do so in theirs, as well. I looked at the state curriculum and realized that my children’s interests were already outstripping what was taught at their grade levels, particularly in social studies and science. I realized I’d have to supplement constantly. I’d have to teach them to subvert their own needs so they wouldn’t make life difficult for the teacher. I’d have to support the school in requiring them to do repetitive practice work over concepts they’d already mastered. I realized they’d have to spend large chunks of their day practicing sight words on flash cards, and I was terribly afraid they’d end up disliking reading. I was afraid that the impulse to learn as a form of recreation would be extinguished.
That’s aside from a great number of peer socialization issues I’ve already mentioned elsewhere.
I wouldn’t have been any more likely to send my child to a traditionally structured private school. The degree of latitude I allow the learning impulse is very difficult to provide in a large group setting. It requires a level of buy-in that just doesn’t exist in most schools, although I’ve seen some fantastic successes. It requires documentation that goes far beyond traditional percentage grades, and it requires teachers to become very skilled in facilitation. My kids couldn’t wait for school reform. They needed it now. And I firmly believe that homeschoolers are an important wake-up call for all the foot-draggers out there who hinder inspired, excellent teachers.
There’s a pretty thorough post about how we homeschool here:
http://grassrootshomeschool.blogspot.com/2007/08/geography-in-our-context.html
Feel free to wander around the blog, if you’ve got time. There are some other great homeschool blogs in the left-hand sidebar.
“And as for public school teachers—I must say I was a little disappointed in the lack of reciprocal curiosity about our practices (in some of the responses). I understand many of you attended public school, or have friends and family members who are teachers. But just as no homeschooling family is alike, no public school is alike either. I can tell you that the public school I attended in Michigan (which, I think, did a fine job) is nothing like the school I teach at now in the Bay Area. My co-workers (specifically those who I collaborate with on a daily basis) are the most exciting, hardworking, inspired people I have EVER known.”
The public school district that we live is wonderful. I am not homeschooling because its a horrible district. I know that it’s a good school district and the teachers are doing an awesome job. I am homeschooling more for philosophical reasons. I don’t want my children to equate learning with something that is only done from 8-2:30 380 days of the year. Rather I want them to see that learning is something one does all their waking hours. That one is always learning. I want them to keep that love for learning. That curiosity about all things.
It’s something that is really hard to explain to others. I constantly get but it’s a wonderful school district from my great aunts who taught in it until they retire. Yes, it is a good school district but I want my children to love learning and realize that learning is a lifestyle. In my opinion the best way to teach it is to live by example. That is something that my teacher friends/relatives do not understand and will never understand because their philosophy is different than mine. That is o.k.
“How do you determine if homeschooling is the best choice for your child? What are the determining factors?”
For me it was seeing children go into school all excited about learning and longing to learn more and later dreading learning. I didn’t what my children to loose that love of learning.
It wasn’t the teachers, it wasn’t the educators, it was the setting. Textbooks are dry and boring. Sitting in a classroom on a beautiful spring day is difficult. Life learning and reading books from authors that are passionate about the subjects are interesting. Taking trips to zoos, parks, forests, museums, historical places are interesting. I decided to opt for the latter option and teach my children myself so that I can keep their learning alive by doing interesting things with them that my public school teacher friends and family members would love to do if their funding permitted.
Alistair,
You and Jesse co-wrote this piece about the creativity and genius of children who are stuck in your classrooms. (I say “stuck” because they are forced there, by law, compulsed to attend–would they be there if they weren’t compelled by the threat of jail?).
This idea — that children “are smarter than you. They are brilliant, funny, creative, and perceptive” is something homeschooling parents have long known. It’s a point on which we can agree, I think.
Further, the idea that the best teachers are those who do not impede the progress of their students is also one that homeschooling parents have long understood and accepted.
It’s also why we take such umbrage when Jesse writes “So, first of all, homeschooling parent, you think you can teach English as well as me? Well, maybe you can. I’ll give you that. But there’s no way that you can teach English as well as me, and biology as well as a trained professional, and history… and Spanish… and art… and counsel for college as well as a school’s guidance counselor… and… and…”
I am one of those who <a href="http://52churches.garriber.org/?p=1361"wasn't really curious about public school teachers", but I’d like to take this opportunity to amend that, and ask a question:
What would you do differently in your teaching practices if your students attended at will? How many of your current students would still bother to come? Why would you change these things (assuming that you have things you’d change)? Why aren’t you doing them now?
–Jen
I would love to answer those questions, but it’s way too late on a school night and I have to go to sleep now. Check back tomorrow evening.
Most of my students do come to school of their own volition. They would be here even if the law didn’t make them. The fact of the matter is, that law is very hard for schools to enforce anyway. It’s all too easy for a kid to stop coming to school. Maybe it’s the bureaucracy, maybe it’s that all the assistant principals are busy handling discipline problems, maybe it’s that the kid’s phone number changed or was disconnected. So, yeah, the kids who are in my class everyday—they want to be there.
But they’re seniors, which means they’ve made it this far. A lot of students don’t make it. One of the biggest parts of my job is persuading, coaxing, sometimes begging students not to drop out. And when one of my students drops out, nine times out of ten it’s not to go learn a trade, or work on an organic farm, or create their own alternative educational experience—it’s giving in to the temptations of the street. Which means there’s a statistical likelihood that they’ll end up in prison or on drugs or dead. And that’s not Hollywood Lean on Me melodrama. That’s for real. It’s on me (and their other teachers) to keep them in school. Which can be confusing sometimes because it’s often those very kids who are going out of their way to ruin my lessons. Yeah, I suppose things would be different if all my students wanted to be there all the time. But that’s not why I got into education. I got in it to work with smart and resilient kids who have really hard lives. This isn’t to say I don’t have high expectations for my classes—I certainly don’t plan for them to be disrupted. I do plan for some students to need a slower place. But I ask all my students to engage with college level ideas, though my methods for getting them there are necessarily different from a college teacher’s. Anyway, I realize my answer is incomplete, but it’s all I have time for now. Thanks for your curiosity.
Alistair
If you’re “persuading, coaxing, sometimes begging [highschool seniors] not to drop out,” because they’d drop out to engage in criminal activities, what is it about graduation that prevents them from doing that in a few month’s time?
–Jen
Followup question: Are the students Jesse has taught very different from the ones you teach?
His article, Hang It Up indicates that he not only needs compulsory attendance laws, but that he’s also not interesting enough to compete with basic technology without rules governing their use.
–Jen
It sounds to me like Jesse just likes to gripe at parents – both the ones who send their kids to school and the ones who keep them at home.
I think every public school teacher needs rules to compete with technology, whether they are school rules or classroom rules. Texting is an absolute plague. I mean, if you go to a movie these days, you’ll see kids texting. I think a lot of teachers just confiscate phones. That’s not my style—I want the student to make the decision not to text—but it’s sure tempting sometimes. The other dilemma is, Do I stop class and waste time just because one kid is texting?
Alistair
Sorry to be so slow on this reply. Graduation doesn’t one hundred percent prevent them from doing that. Those influences run deep. But from what I’ve seen (and I think statistics will show this to be true) students are incrementally less likely to succumb to those kinds of pressures with each level of education attained. The more options in a student’s life, the less likely they are to choose the negative ones (which, for many, are there at birth).
One of the most difficult things I dealt with in the classroom was parents who didn’t care. The real differences between my students had much more to do with the support they were getting at home than intelligence or anything else.
That is the one thing I really wish I could change about my brief teaching career…that I had fought sooner to engage the parents as much as I could.
Thankfully, my children won’t have that to worry about. They wouldn’t in the public school, either, but this is how we’ve chosen to structure our family for now.
And as to the actual questions:
I would love to know what it takes to be a good homeschool teacher.
Love and passion and a willingness to learn and seek help. (You’ve probably noticed we don’t lack in the passion department.)
How do you balance being both parent and teacher to your child?
I think there is a false separation there. We’ve all heard that a “parent is a child’s first teacher.” It is like being a parent who leads the child along in learning about the world. As all parents do, but perhaps a little more intentionally.
How do you incorporate technology into your lessons?
Actually, I find integrating technology much easier as a homeschooler than I did as a public school teacher. There is just more time. (Shameless plug: my 10 year old has her own science e-zine we work on together and she’s learned a lot from it The Science Mouse)
How do you go about teaching a subject you know very little about?
If I expect my child to learn it, I should be able to take the time to learn it. We’ll see when we get to high school, but suspect we’ll exchange lessons or I’ll enroll her in a course.
How much homework do you give? Is it even called ‘homework’ when it’s assigned at home?
When I was teaching, I was told the main purpose of homework was to let the parents see what we were working on in class and give extra practice. The first reason isn’t very relevant. And since I know what my children struggle with, I bring those things up for mini-lessons throughout the day. They have independent work, too, but I don’t look at it as homework.
Do your students have to take the same standardized tests as mine? If so, how much test prep do you do each week?
Not here, but my tests are harder. I do occasionally print off practice tests from state assessments or released copies of older tests. But that is the test prep as I ready them for the SAT.
I wrote a very nice, chatty post about homeschooling on Jesse’s blog, explaining that I am a college professor who homeschools and that there are actually a good number of us out here (we even have our own yahoo group)! Oddly, it never posted. Sigh. Always save copies of your posts! ;->
I agree with you. It all comes down to who is doing the teaching, doesn’t it? Is the parent or teacher really invested in the student? If so, good things are generally bound to happen. My daughter is a bright, sensitive, outgoing, personable kid–but she was harrangued in preschool for wanting to dance to music rather than sit quietly in circle time (she had only just turned three). This was the end of a long string of issues we had with the two schools we tried. We began homeschooling then and it has worked so well, we just never looked back.
I teach in a classroom, online, and at home. They are quite different animals, each of them. While I have to construct learning experiences for my college students (as is appropriate, given that they come to me looking for a specialist), learning with my daughter happens pretty naturally. We do a grammar and math lesson first thing after breakfast (sometimes before), and then the rest of our work is sprinkled through the day. She began reading early, so she reads every day, but I don’t need to time her–I just know she’s reading because I see her doing it and she talks about it later. (I do “strew” interesting books in her path so that she can “discover” them herself). We listen to a lot of audio in the car (Jim Weiss cds are our favorites. He’s a professional storyteller and specializes in classics). Right now we’re listening to Robin Hood and discussing King Richard and the crusades. In our discussion, I toss out the fact that in the original Robin Hood novel, King Richard wasn’t out of the country at all and we talk about how that changes things. We also talk about the history of England’s monarchy, how Richard’s brother John was eventually forced to sign the Magna Carta, which limited the power of Kings. That’s just one example, but that’s how it works for history.
For science we have both a book which introduces concepts (abiotic, biotic, organism, etc.) and some fun experiments (we’re only midway through second grade, so they are easy and fun–for example, playing with magnets to discuss magnetism, timing chipped ice versus cubed to see if they melt at the same rate under the same conditions, doing pond studies to learn to use the microscope and identify the different life forms in our water). We live near the Puget Sound, so the summer is spent outside learning about all our wildlife (don’t be jealous, but we have nesting eagles!) So sometimes science is done on the beach, sometimes in a kayak, and sometimes on our back patio.
As for the things I can’t cover–we won’t get there until after Algebra, lol. There are so many resources out there the real job is deciding what to use! Khan Academy has tons of free videos teaching math (MIT graduate), many universities have courses online for free, there are community college courses available on the high school level, the larger community itself has many, many people who are marvelous teachers despite their lack of a certification (my daughter takes Spanish, chess, piano, soccer, and art classes, is a scout, attends a coop and a weekly “book sharing” club at the library, and has playgroups twice a week). We find teachers at the geology society, the coin shop, the grocery store, the local science museum, the historical society, the ferry office, the vet’s office, our neighbor who helped his father and uncle build the roads into what is now our neighborhood sixty years ago–the list goes on and on.
Honestly, I think it’s what every passionate teacher would love to be able to give to each of their students, but simply cannot. You’d have to have one teacher to about six or seven kids for the whole year to have that happen, and you just don’t have the freedom to pick up and go outside, to explore, when you have to get permission slips and deal with liability.
So, thanks for letting me have my say. Hopefully this posting will make it!
FYI—I checked to see if your other post somehow ended up in the spam folder, but it wasn’t there. Maybe Jesse or I already approved it and it’s posted now? If not, sorry about that. I don’t know what happened. Thanks for taking the time to write again.
Off-topic request to M. Borrego:
You wrote:
“In our discussion, I toss out the fact that in the original Robin Hood novel, King Richard wasn’t out of the country at all and we talk about how that changes things.”
I was always a fan of the many versions of Robin Hood myself. (Never could get my kids interested in it, unfortunately.) Which version is the “original novel, where King Richard wasn’t out of the country”? I haven’t seen that one, and I would like to. (Author/publisher/isbn?)
Please email me at lindabav at netzero dot net. Thanks.
“How do you determine if homeschooling is the best choice for your child? What are the determining factors?”
The first answer depends on the child. If the child does not want to be homeschooled, there is no reason to explore the idea further. If either parent is against the idea of homeschooling, I would recommend further study and not doing anything drastic until the whole family is on board.
The trigger for me was when, in 8th grade, my eldest son threatened to kill himself if we sent him on to high school. He was quite serious. How could I not do something equally drastic to save him?
My middle son went from all A’s and a Presidential Scholar award in 5th grade to failing most classes in 6th grade. Though we had worked with his teachers for accommodations, we were still fighting soul-sucking policies like “if a 6th grader gets less than a B+ in 7th grade science, that 6th grader will repeat 7th grade science.” Despite the fact that the 7th grader who sat next to him all year could get a D- and still go on to 8th grade science.
My 5th grader had been struggling with organizational, reading and math issues that no one could figure out. After having him home for a year, I was able to research and find an appropriate professional to diagnose his eye-teaming issue, which made all the letters in his books double and also made it impossible for him to line up a math problem correctly. He’d been having school problems since 2nd grade–it took him three hours to complete his homework in third grade–but despite my warnings that something was wrong, the teachers were quite sure he was “just an average kid.” An average 10 yo does not cry over homework every night and withdraw from his friends and family.
That same son has now brought his reading and math from ~4th gr. when we brought him home (as a rising 6th grader) to 8-9th gr. (as a rising 9th grader). He feels he’s ready to go to the public high school.
And that’s cool with me. We’ve worked out a way for him to take English and algebra at home with me, because we know what works best for him, plus he’ll has a greater pool of friends and the benefits that a large school can bring: band, jazz band, drama club, forensics, and vet science classes.
Much of that can be had in our community–he just finished three years of middle school band through a homeschool friendly school program–but it’s a lot easier for *me* (being selfish) to only have to drop him off once and let him take the bus home.
My middle son will go to the high school for German and jewelry-making but refuses to take anything but electives there. He has never bowed to behavior modification techniques (most gifted kids see gold stars as manipulative) or rewards such as grades. He’s seen a better way. He’s not looking back.
“How do you determine if homeschooling is the best choice for your child? What are the determining factors? ”
OK, I admit this question made me laugh, but only because I know that when I write my answer I’m sure it will sound ridiculous.
When our daughter was approaching school age we had 3 options: the local public school (which by all government standards is a very good one), a nearby church-run private school (which has a very reasonable tuition but was still out of our budget), or homeschooling. My husband and I spent many night debating the merits of each after putting our kids to bed, and since we’re Christians, we prayed about it a lot too.
In the end, we felt like God wanted us to homeschool. I decided to give it a go mostly because I’m lazy. The idea of dragging my night owl daughter out of bed 5 days a week to get her to school by 7:45 AM (and taking the baby too) and then going back to pick her up 2 1/2 hours later (our district has 1/2 day Kindergarten) sounded awful to me. So I thought to myself, “Hey, I’ll try homeschooling for kindergarten. How badly can I really mess up kindergarten?”
Guess what? It turns out we love homeschooling! My daughter and I had so much fun learning how to read and write letters and reading good books about science and history and everything else (and all in about 1 1/2 – 2 hours a day) that I can’t imagine sending her to school now. I think about all those hours of the day that she would be gone (and probably bored stiff most of the time, as I was when I was a student) and it just sounds bizarre to me. And please note: before I decided to give homeschooling a try I was one of those Moms who was excited about my daughter staring school because of the thought of having a little time to myself every day.
Some families decide to homeschool before they ever even have a child. Others decide to try it after their children struggle in a traditional school setting. Most of the homeschool families I know don’t approach it as “this is the only education system that will work for my children.” Instead they say, “Yeah, they could probably go to school and do fine, buy why should they when we’re doing so well at home? And having so much fun?”
(Most days anyway. Like any other job/profession, there are days when we homeschool Moms want to throw in the towel, but we hang in there!)
I think a lot of people think of homeschoolers as people who have rejected the mainstream cultural values and norms, so they react in defense of their own choices. But I’m not out there to rock any boats. I’m just making the choices that work for our family, and if they’re not what other people would do, well that’s OK with me.
This blog itself contains a great deal of content that “takes a swipe” at public schools. Why are you allowed to do it and the home educating parents are not?
At least 20 of the responding parents on this thread were PS teachers, are related to PS teachers, are friends with PS teachers or somehow have other regular contact with PS teachers. It’s not that we’re not curious per say, it’s that we’ve had our curiosity regularly satisfied through these contacts with those that work inside the system whereas many more PS teachers do not actually have a personal relationship with a home educating parent.
Can or should our nation ever totally get rid of public education? No. There are children out there who do, in fact, need the system to exist. But many more people could homeschool (and benefit from it) than do. It is about adjusting your lifestyle and making choices. I know single parent homeschoolers, parents who figured out how to each work part-time or to job share and split the teaching duties also, parents who adjusted schedules and manage to both work full time and still homeschool. I know parents who homeschool in their native language and also learn English together as a family. I know families who make home education work against amazing odds because taking personal responsibility for their children’s educations is just that important to them. The kids who need the system deserve much better than the system that exists today. You have written material on this blog that says as much. They deserve educators who will fight for them. But if you could give them a parent or parents who would make their educations as high a priority as home educating parents do, wouldn’t you? If you could educate them without having to struggle against oppressive bureacracy, wouldn’t that be fabulous? If you could take them out into the world and show them how many amazing opportunties exist out there for them to take ahold of, what a difference that might make, right?
That’s what we do. That’s why we do what we do. Are we really all that different at our cores?
I think it’s perfectly fine to take a swipe at public education as long as it’s done constructively—and not dismissively or in a generalized kind of way. When I critique public schools, it’s because I’m deeply invested in them. Of course, as I mentioned in my previous reply, this is the same blog that published a very inflammatory argument against homeschooling. So I understand your ire. The gut impulse is to fight fire with fire.
I should be specific — not your ire, but the ire of homeschoolers.
You asked, “How do you determine if homeschooling is the best choice for your child? What are the determining factors?”
Wow, that was such a long time ago for me – 15 years, where has the time gone? Anyway, we started homeschooling when my girls ended fourth and second grades. There was no one reason, there were many:
- our doctor. He told us we would be healthier if we homeschooled. We were catching ever single virus that anyone in the school caught. He was right.
- my oldest was night owl. The school schedule did not agree with her natural circadian rhythm.
- bad teachers. We had good teachers too, but the damage done by the bad ones far outweighed any good one by the good ones.
- boredom. I too have above average kids. I know there are arrogant teachers out there (like your friend Jesse) who think we all just believe that because we are parents. The truth is the schools are woefully ill-equipped to teach above average children, so we tend to be the ones who leave the most. My girls we plain and simple bored to tears in school. The dealt with that in different ways. My older daughter rebelled and took joy in making fun of her teachers’ mistakes. My younger daughter spent her time in school studying human nature and the people around her. She is to this day able to get anyone to do almost anything she wants. Neither of those attitudes are things I would have chosen for my daughters to learn – but when faced with extreme boredom, it is human nature to find something to fill the time, so they did.
my son – He is my youngest and we were already homeschooling when it was time for him to start kindergarten. We sent him to K, just so he could get a feel for what school was. He had a great teacher for 8 months and then a REALLY bad substitute for the last month. That really great teacher dealt with him quite well, the sub was completely clueless about how to handle and unusual child. Three years later (during which we homeschooled) he had a major breakdown. We moved to a new house and it really knocked him flat. We had him screen by a psychologist and the diagnosis was Aspergers. (More about him, in the answer to the comment below.)
“I also feel as if I must address some of the misconceptions about public schools. Yes, public schools are messed up. We can blame that on the government, bad administrators, bad teachers, the union, lack of funds, standardized testing, NCLB—pick your poison.”
Those are all reasons why the public schools are failing, but they are NOT the underlying cause of the failure. The underlying cause of all of the failure in our public schools can be traced back to one core principle that our schools are built upon. The idea that every child can and should learn the same things, at the same times, in the same ways is the biggest cause of failure in our schools.
Just using my family, I can show that different kids are ready for reading at different times. My oldest read the public school way – she learned to read when she was around 6. My middle child figured out the reading thing when she was 4 – with no one teaching her, just by watching me read aloud to her. My youngest, well he would have present the schools with a major problem – he didn’t read until he was almost 10. We exposed him to it, taught it to him, worked with him constantly in fun ways but he just could not get it. Suddenly at 10 he was reading high school level textbooks, go figure.
That experience was what woke me up to the fact that our schools have this fundamental flaw. In school my son would have been labeled ‘slow’, and that would have stayed in his “all important permanent record” to color how every teacher saw him after that. My experience with my son is one that is repeated hundreds of times in the homeschool community. I frequently run into other parents who tell the same story of boys (it usually is a boy) who didn’t learn to read until they were 10 or older and who when they started reading caught up and surpassed their peers in a matter of months.
You had also asked why we aren’t interested in learning about public schools. I don’t need to go far to satisfy that particular curiosity. First, I went to school for 13 years, I think I understand what it is all about.
Second, my mother, my brother, two aunts, and three cousins all work or worked withing the school system in various aspects; among them there are teachers, administrators, cafeteria workers and office staff, oh and one cousin drove a bus for a while. I’ve seen the schools from about every point of view possible.
Third, I babysit for a public school family full time. That puts me in contact with the public school system once a day five days a week. That particular school is one I would say is a good one in relative terms. Even so, I see all the ways the system is failing those children by expecting them to all be the same.
I appreciate your apparent willingness to keep an open-mind. Unfortunately the small group of teachers who are openly negative toward homeschoolers are poisoning the debate we could be having about why homeschoolers score better on average on standardized tests and why they consistently shine in every study ever done. The reason has nothing to do with religion. It has nothing to do with the quality of teachers. The reason, plain and simple is that homescoolers are free to tailor each and every child’s education to that particular child’s needs. That is something that you, as a teacher with 30 or so students at a time are precluded from doing.
What a great post! Your journey sounds much like ours and I agree completely with your conclusion.
Bridget wrote: “I too have above average kids. … The truth is the schools are woefully ill-equipped to teach above average children, so we tend to be the ones who leave the most.”
Actually, I think there are as many parents who leave for the opposite reason. Kids with learning disabilities, who can’t keep up, and whose needs are not being met by the schools’ special ed programs. And the “twice exceptional” kids, who are both gifted in some areas *and* have learning disabilities. My daughter is in the first category, and my son is in the second. The teachers and school counselor, when my now 18 y.o. son was in 3rd and 4th grade, insisted that he couldn’t possibly be learning disabled (even though he had been tested and diagnosed with a.d.d. and dyslexia) because he was so obviously highly intelligent. So they called him lazy, and the school counselor told him that he would “never be able to get a job or have any money” when he grew up (I was sitting right there when she said it!), and the teachers ignored his i.e.p. (My daughter’s teachers ignored her i.e.p. too.) I wanted to homeschool them for over a year before we actually started homeschooling. But my husband was opposed, and it took a long time to convince him it would be best for the kids.
I’m glad you preface your post saying you don’t know much about homeschooling. This is shown very clearly by the questions you pose and the things incite your curiousity.
First off—no, most homeschooling parents are not too curious about what it’s like to be a public school teacher. Most people who are homeschooling their children attended school, and likely public school as children. Also, there is a significant portion of homeschooling parents who are public school teachers.
I am very carefully saying homeschooling parents rather than homeschool teachers. This is a very significant distinction. Most parents learn very quickly that “teaching” is not their role in a homeschooling family.
Once you and any parent understands that children are naturally curious and, like sponges, want to learn, want more information and will seek it out, then you are on your way to a successful homeschool experience.
Most of us who have homeschooled our children start out teaching but learn very soon that we are interfering with our children’s education by doing so. Children are not like little birds that require spoon feeding. Homeschool parents are at their best when we help our children find resources and assist them in the “how” of learning rather than the “what”.
If you can understand this one point, many of the other questions you ask are answered or become irrelevant.
Look. I think homeschooling is great. Really. And I think you will find more support if you advocate for your personal choice without condemning the other choices. This morning, at the public school where I teach, I witnessed students working on video documentaries, collaborating to create a newspaper, and listening to a guest speaker who came to discuss classist and racist policies that guide military recruitment. This is not your grandmother’s or even your public school. To be honest, I think we are talking about two very different worlds—this doesn’t mean that they don’t speak to each other, just that the conversation should be approached in the same careful and respectful way as an outsider would approach a different culture. I would also point out that many of the homeschooling parents who have already responded are curious about public school teachers.
I think you would find homeschoolers much less likely to come to your blog in mass to defend their choices if you didn’t put out posts like “The Case Against Homeschooling.”
Maybe this blog could use some lessons on understanding and tolerance.
Alastair, do you feel we are condemning other choices because some of the home school teachers here have used the B word (“boring”) in describing why they left school? As a national gifted ed. advocate, the first thing I teach parents is never to use the B word when trying to get appropriate accommodations for their child. So bad on us for that one.
However, I would point out that the large majority of the thoughtful responses you have received to this post are from parents of gifted and/or LD children who just are not getting their appropriate education from the local schools. We have tried. We have advocated. We have volunteered, taught pull-outs, written grants, developed curricula and coached after school activities.
When we say we homeschool to avoid boredom, it’s not because we’re expecting our kids to be entertained every minute of every day. It’s not because our little darlings are more precious than anyone else’s. It’s because our kids need rigor, they need challenge and they deserve to learn something new every single blessed day.
Yes, we can enrich at home–and do–but then what do we need schools for? Babysitting? Surely not. That is not a teacher’s job. Socialization–I am not opening that can of worms again. And the advocacy wheel turns round and round. Every gain we make is erased after nine months when we meet the next teacher and begin the “Will you please accommodate my child’s needs in your classroom?” dance again.
After awhile, you just get tired. That’s not intended to be disrespectful, only truthful.
I hear that. Boredom is one of my greatest enemies as a teacher, and I would be a liar if I didn’t admit to boring my students on occasion. I do my best to engage them, but as many of you have written, it’s damned hard with 32 students with different learning styles and different needs. Some inevitably are going to get bored.
That’s not what I was referring to when I said some of the responses condemned other choices. I meant comments like “warehouses of multiculturalism,” and “in [public] school, the main goal is control and conformity.”
Thank-you for all your responses to my post.
The problem is that in school control and conformity, while they may not be goals, are in fact a necessity.
You have 30 or so students in a classroom – how can that possibly work if you have 30 8 year olds, 4 of whom won’t be ready to read for another year and 3 who have been reading since they were 4 and are now reading Madeline L’Engle, of 2 of the late readers one of the early ones and 2 other students are ready for pre-algebra and 4 students haven’t mastered addition yet. THAT is what you could face in any 2nd grade across the country. In a great district, you might have programs in place for both your gifted and your delayed learners, but I’d bet good money that those districts are few and far between. And, I have yet to hear of any district that can cope with an 8 year old who is both ready for pre-algebra and can’t read yet.
That doesn’t even begin to address the social aspects of schools today. My daughter was called a lesbian in fourth grade because she was not ‘girly’ enough. If you think there is no pressure to conform in your school, I encourage you to take a much closer look.
This morning, at the public school where I teach, I witnessed students …. listening to a guest speaker who came to discuss classist and racist policies that guide military recruitment.
Oh, boy. I don’t suppose these students were exposed to a different point of view, were they? Like maybe some military recruiters coming in to explain how classist and racist policies, contrary to Michael Moore’s inaccurate screed, do NOT guide their recruitment?
I’m glad someone else mentioned this. I had to leave it for a few days to let my blood pressure go down. So, was there anyone else? Since you have mentioned that you are in a school that has kids that would, in the view of this person, be ‘targeted’, was the point of this to keep students from enlisting, or was it just to ‘broaden’ their perspective?
>And I think you will find more support if you advocate for your personal choice without condemning the other choices.
By the same token, teachers would find they are more respected if they are less condemning of homeschoolers. It’s a two way street. (And fwiw, I have never had a problem with teachers, schools, etc. And have, despite my son having moved on to college, continued to voice that in the homeschool community.)
Thank you for a more respectful, open-minded post! I have answered your questions on my blog:
http://www.mariposahomeschool.org/blogs/?p=171
Hi Alistair,
I’ll answer this question you asked.
I’m a homeschool mom whose only prior teaching experience was doing corporate training (teaching new hires how to do their job). I also wrote curriculum and created presentations to teach subject matter expert content to new hires and existing employees so they could do their jobs in ways to match the real outcome required by the company or to comply with state or federal law. In other words taking end content and breaking it down into the relevant job processes, documenting it in writing to be used as references by employees then teaching it to all employees affected by the new process. (It was a good warm up for my transition to homeschooling mother, I believe.)
You asked: “And as homeschool teachers, aren’t you just as curious about the life of a public school teacher?”
My answer:
I have too much information to be curious at this point. I’m saturated with information to be honest. How?
Some of my friends and relatives today are school teachers.
Some of my best friends from public school went to college to become a teacher and are still doing that 20 years later.
Some of my homeschool mom friends used to be teachers.
Some people my DH knows through his non-teaching job used to be teachers.
Some of my DH’s former co-workers are now college professors.
I talk to all of those people and hear their stories and philosophies.
I also know some teacher’s aides, mostly former career women turned stay at home mom who was later recruited by the school principals who liked them and thought they’d be great teacher’s aides.
I know some people working as tutors to kids in public and private school and have heard their opinions on school teaching and struggling learners and how their 1:1 tutoring and different teaching methods helps their pupils.
Some moms I know both homeschool and use public schools. Some of them have been elected to the Board of Education. I talk to them and hear insider stories from the school administrators.
I also read blogs and articles and books written by school teachers.
I also read books on the topic of improving public education and education reform written by school teachers and school administrators.
I read books written for classroom teachers about how to teach kids, different teaching methods, approaches, and philosophies and figure out which I want to use in our homeschool.
I also have read about different “alternative” education theories and methods and have adapted some for our homeschool over the years (Waldorf, Montessori, Charlotte Mason, and Classical Education being some of them).
It is not hard to educate oneself on what teachers are using for teaching materials nor is it hard to figure out where the challenges lie and what some of the real life issues are that teachers have to contend with in the classroom (not all are academic related).
One more thing: the fact that I enjoy homeschooling my kids does not mean I’d ever want to be a classroom teacher. The fact that my children learn does not necessarily mean I personally would want to teach other kids or would be good at it. I think classroom teaching in public school in America and homeschoooling in America is an apples to oranges comparison.
I also don’t feel we’re in competition with each other.
{Alistair}, nice to meet you.
ChristineMM
A couple of more things.
I am a volunteer with Cub Scouts and Boy Scouts. I have just finished my fifth year as a Den Leader. I work with boys in groups (small classes basically) of same age/same grade. They are homeschooled and public schooled and private schooled. In that way I am a teacher of sorts, dealing with small classroom management, different behaviors and trying to get through formal lessons and learning objectives (the Scout requirements).
I also have volunteered at Cub Day Camp with 12-17 kids:1 ratio. And also volunteered at Boy Scout Residence Camp (sleep over camp). I dealt with larger groups of boys there of age 10-17 living with them 24/7.
Those things have given me insight to some stuff that teachers contend with in school and not all of it is pretty and not all is easy for me, the adult to deal with. I did learn though that it would be a joy to be with and teach some of the kids on a daily basis for 180 school days if I were their school teacher instead of knowing them for one week only. Some of the kids are interesting to be around in a learning environment, seeing them learn and overcome challenges, to see the joy in learning and such.
My point is to share I am not just only with my own kids and knowing only my homeschooled kids in learning environments.
Oh and also I have been around other homeschooled kids in formal learning situations as their teacher or facilitator. Other times I’ve witnessed subject matter experts teaching homeschooled kids things in classroom type situations (i.e. Wall Street professional teaching kids stock market, architect teaching engineering to middle school aged kids, nature enthusiast teaching nature class, bird rescuer teaching about birds, woodworkers teaching woodworking, poets teaching poetry writing, and a children’s pastor teaching Sunday School).
I just noticed the title of this entry is “Homeschool Teacher, meet Public School Teacher. Now hug.”
That’s pretty funny given that this whole thing started because the Public School Teacher ran up to the Homeschool Teacher and called him (generic term for the sake of space, which I just wasted in my caveat) a bunch of names and sucker-punched him in the gut.
Now the Public School Teacher wants to be magnanimous and tell the Homeschool Teacher how to react appropriately. Oh, what lovely irony.
Ok. Public school teacher, meet homeschool teacher. Now hug.
I put ‘homeschool teacher’ first because I wanted to make sure all of our homeschool visitors knew this was another post about homeschooling. I’m not sure where in my post I told homeschool teachers how to react appropriately. I was simply asking that we both try to learn from each other.
Alistair
You’re kidding right? The whole tone of your post was condescending (and I don’t particularly care who was listed first). If I put up a post on my blog about how public school teachers were just a bunch of child molesters who couldn’t make it in any other profession and were overpaid to boot, I can imagine a lot of public school teachers would be offended and let me know it. As well they should, it’s an offensive stereotype (and NOT my perception of public school teachers).
Then I put up another post on my blog, calling for the public school teachers to be understanding of the other side and spouting platitudes about how we have so much to learn from each other. Would you really think I was sincere?
The post “The Case Against Homeschooling” could be viewed as a ridiculous parody, but the author seemed quite sincere. And that makes it offensive. I’m not one of those sensitive types who thinks I have a Constitutional right not to be offended, but I AM one of those passionate people who won’t let a completely legitimate and sometimes lifesaving (in the figurative sense if not the literal) option for many families be treated like a joke. It seems many of my fellow homeschoolers feel the same.
And for their trouble, they get a “can’t we all just get along” speech from you. I’m sure they feel very comforted.
“You’re kidding right? The whole tone of your post was condescending (and I don’t particularly care who was listed first). ”
I didn’t think that his post was condescending. I felt that it was genuine. I wish that we homeschoolers could get past our needs to feel defensive. It would go a lot farther in helping our cause. Yes, some public school teachers would like too see homeschooling illegal but from my experience they are in the minority. Most people that I talk to are very open to homeschooling and the idea of homeschool if we are willing to actually drop our defenses and dialogue with them.
Shevrae, this is a group blog, and the rude anti-homeschooling posts were by Jesse. This one is by Alistair, who does seem to be trying. =)
Alistair, I know today’s public schools are not my grandmother’s. But I don’t think any of us who explained why we weren’t curious about learning a public school teacher’s perspective from this blog said no, we knew we all we needed to know because our grandparents taught school- some of us, including me, INCLUDED our grandparents in the long list of teachers we have known, but ALL of us also included people we know now who are actively teaching. So that wasn’t really a very fair criticism on your part. Logistically, you asking a minority group why we aren’t more curious about a majority group, and we’ve explained why most of us have that knowledge gap filled in pretty regularly.
Incidentally, you think it’s an unfair swipe at the public schools to say they exist to develop conformity. But Jesse’s criticism of homeschoolers (or one of them) was precisely that our kids do NOT conform and so public schooled kids mock them. However ill judged of him to say what he said, that indicates he does believe conformity to public school culture is a plus, and a lack of conformity is a bad thing, and lack of conformity is fostered by being homeschooled.
Here in my little town I have heard twice from people who don’t know each other that their child’s first grade teacher has instructed them NOT to continue to teach reading to their children at home because they are getting too far ahead of the class. One mother explained to the teacher that she didn’t mean to push her child, but the boy was eager to learn- he asked her what the letters said, and how to sound out words. “What am I supposed to do when he asks?” she said, “Just tell him, ‘no,’ I won’t answer your question?”
And the teacher, according to this mother, told her, “You tell him that it’s the teacher’s job to answer that question.”
As for the need for public schools to exist to serve the poor, underprivileged children from broken homes- my husband is a poster child for one of those homes- you can read about it here, but the short version is his high school drop out parents (children of drop outs as well) married as teens, split up when he was a baby, they were alcoholics who married at least five times apiece, and then he ended up being raised by a grandma with an 8th grade education and no respect for academics at all- and the school system *completely* failed him. Nobody cared if he read or didn’t do his homework and so he didn’t. I’ve told other teachers this story and they get huffy and say he ought to have taken responsbility for himself- well, eventually he did, but I thought schools were supposed to exist specifically for kids like him? Where was he going to learn to value an education (since nobody at home valued it) if his teachers made it clear they thought he was a stupid waste of their time?
He dropped out at 15 to roof houses. Then at 17 he finally got serious about getting his diploma- he went to night school at the local high school where he was exploited by one teacher who gave him a passing grade in exchange for manual labour, exchanged another passing grade for drugs with another teacher, and received a diploma that meant absolutely nothing. I think he was defrauded.
I have asked this question on my blog before, and I’d really like to see it discussed.
Yes, there should be something there for kids like my husband once was. But I don’t think public schools have shown themselves to be the right answer. I am not saying I have the right answer, but I am saying we have to be honest think much harder about what we take for granted- and look at how many kids graduate with a diploma who cannot read, for instance, and consider what it means to both say the public schools HAVE to exist to be there for kids from homes like my husband’s and then say but of course the public schools can’t educate everybody, especially kids who come from backgrounds like my husband’s.
Pingback: Notes from the sidelines of the public school/homeschool wars « The Eye of the Hurricane
I’ll answer each of your questions in turn:
How do you balance being both parent and teacher to your child?
Unlike many of your respondents, this WAS an issue for us. The main problem, though, was getting my oldest child to accept me as his teacher, since I did not homeschool him from the beginning. After that, it just became another duty as their parent.
How do you incorporate technology into your lessons?
My oldest uses a typing tutor. Other than that, I don’t “incorporate” technology. They use it when they need to, and don’t at all other times. They are not allowed to use a calculator during math until they are doing algebra. In my opinion, at that time, the need is not to inforce computation skills, rather to learn algebra. If I feel they need to work on computation, we will go back and do a review of that. So far, we have not run into that issue.
How do you go about teaching a subject you know very little about?
So far, the subject I have known the least about is the subject that my oldest knows the most about- history. For history and literature, the main key is finding excellent books for them to read. Science has been a bit more complicated. We currently use five methods for science. We use an online program that the boys enjoy. This online progam is called CyberEd and it is my understanding that it is used in some school rooms, as well. We read a lot of books- biographies, encyclopedias, and anything we can find about a given subject at the library. We do experiments. We do nature study (get out and study nature and keep journals about it). Finally, we also watch videos that are science related. This is fun because there are so many out there.
How much homework do you give? Is it even called ‘homework’ when it’s assigned at home?
I’m not sure ‘homework’ is the right word. Independent work might be a better word in the homeschool setting. Most of my 8 and 11 year old sons’ work is independent. I assign it. They do it. We discuss it. I grade it. (Yes, I do give grades, but mostly because they ask for them.) The 5 year old does most of his work with me. He is still learning phonics, so I do most of his reading with him.
Do your students have to take the same standardized tests as mine? If so, how much test prep do you do each week?
My children do not have to take any standardized tests. My oldest took the Explore test last January, so that I could see where he placed. This was for my own information. Imagine my surprise when the test came back and confirmed everything I already knew about him: poor math skills (much better now!), great vocabulary, good science, great reading-but has problems picking out the main idea (he tends to focus on details). I already knew all these things, but it was nice to have it confirmed.
As far as test prep, the day before he took the test, I handed him a practice booklet, provided by ACT, so that he could see the general format of the test. I think tests should measure what a person knows and truly understands. As a result, I think test prep should be done away with, as it is currently thought of. In generaly, with this philosophy, I believe that every day, every minute, of our lives is test prep.
In short, I want to know your best (and worst) practices.
Best practices: letting my sons follow rabbit trails, letting the boys play outside for several hours each day, making sure that they have access to as much good literature as possible
worst practices: allowing papers to pile up, buying too much curriculum, buying too many books
And as homeschool teachers, aren’t you just as curious about the life of a public school teacher? If for nothing else, to rethink and reshape your own teaching philosophies?
Honestly? I’m not. I believe that the life of a public school teacher is not much different than the life of other people. The fact is that everyone chooses their profession. Then, they do what they must to support that profession. They can hate it or love it, but that is their choice.
Do I think that public school teachers can change my own teaching philosophies? To what point? I read prodigious numbers of books on learning styles, teaching methods, literature choices, math curriculum… The reading never ends. I spend most of MY ‘free-reading’ time researching options for my children. I think that is probably enough.
And one more thing, I DO have teachers in my family- sister-in-law & her husband, brother-in-law, multiple cousins, aunts, and uncles. I also have multiple friends whom are either teachers or have been teachers. I have also spent many hours volunteering in the classroom. I KNOW what teachers go through. Do I think that is relative to my pursuit of my children’s education at HOME? No.
How do you determine if homeschooling is the best choice for your child? What are the determining factors?
This was a long evolution for us. I always WANTED to homeschool my children. To me, the ability to continuously evaluate and change the education of a child, based on that child’s current needs, was the epitome of the best education. However, when my oldest son was kindergarten age, I sent him off. Kindergarten was a really good thing for my son. His teacher (public school) was fabulous. That summer, we moved to another school district. His first grade teacher asked if there was anything she needed to know about him. My reply was that he had immature fine motor skills. She spent the rest of the year telling him he was immature (which, quite frankly was false). My oldest son was adding and subtracting when he was 3. He also caught onto reading rather quickly. His kindergarten teacher recognized these traits and allowed him to progress. In fact, she forced him to progress. However, his first grade teacher forced him to start counting on his fingers. By the end of first grade, he was positive that he could not do math.
I pulled him out of school to homeschool him. However, it was NOT a good year. I was determined that he would catch up on math, and I had not learned the lesson of changing a curriculum if it does not fit your child’s learning style. We moved again during that year (husband is military), and we put him in a private school for 3rd and 4th grade.
When we moved at the end of 4th grade to our current residence, we chose our house based on the fact that the county gives IEPs for gifted students. Unfortunately, the school refused to test him, or take his old teacher’s recommendation. “Besides,” they told me, “the reading here is very advanced.” I was encouraged by this. I asked for a reading list of the books he would be reading in 5th grade. They WERE excellent books. However, they were books that he had read 3 years before. They REFUSED to accomidate him. As a result, we decided to give homeschooling another try. He didn’t want to. But, I told him that he could go back to school at any time.
That was last year. We have been homeschooling for 2 years now. I ask my children at the beginning of each year if they would like to go back to school. They always say no. My oldest son is now thriving, not only in reading, but in math. He managed to shoot through pre-algebra in 6 weeks. I decided that I would force him to slow down for algebra. However, instead of making him to take the same course all year, I found three different curriculums that cover different aspects of algebra, so that he would not be *gasp* bored.
It’s working for us. Yes, it was my first choice. It was not my second choice. But, in the end, it was our only choice.
My daughter is only six weeks old, but since I was homeschooled from day one myself I feel qualified to enter this discussion. Maybe a homeschool graduate’s perspective will help.
First and most importantly, there was no difference in our home between “parent” and “teacher”. My parents taught me writing and math like they taught me to dress myself and tie my shoes. They were the most important and formative people in my life.
My mother was my primary teacher. She was a product of the Northern Virginia gifted-and-talented programs, graduated high school in ’82 and became a wife and mother pretty much immediately. Yes, not only did she not have a teaching degree, she didn’t have a college degree at all. Yet she taught me well enough that I have a master’s in computer science. One of my sisters is working on her Ph.D in history; one of my brothers is double majoring in computer science and electrical engineering. All of us are excellent writers, have a better background in history and liberal arts than our college classmates did, and know the skills necessary to succeed academically. Homeschool parents choose solid curriculum, find other tutors for their children, or even learn a subject week by week in advance of teaching it. All these strategies work.
Homework? To a well organized homeschool, “homework” is a laughable concept. Without the time that organized schools must waste on transitions between classes, discipline problems, and keeping the slowest student in class on track, you don’t need to spend that many hours on school work. Until high school, I rarely spent more than three hours a day accomplishing my academics.
Standardized tests? I can’t speak for anyone else, but my family found them laughable easy. We received one instruction session on how to take a standardized test and that was it. “Teaching to the test” still doesn’t make sense to me. Surely if you properly learn a subject, you’ve covered everything you need for any test.
I wouldn’t trade my homeschool experience for anything. My husband and I are looking forward to educating our own children at home too.
Some stray thoughts…
This is the way we learned “technology”:
When my oldest kids (now in college and graduated fr college) were about 10 and 12, I told them, “Your grandmother is worried that you don’t type with your hands in the correct positions.” Then I showed them the correct position and urged them to type correctly. My oldest son now types 90 wpm w/ accuracy!
We also gave them wide access to a variety of software programs and let them hang around computer guys who were interested in strange concepts like binary numbers and creating video games. One kid in particular began using his algebra in a pre-existing game platform to create animations and games, which he then entered in online competitions for “best games.” He found collaborators (online) and they continued their passion. He also played online games like Runescape until he was one of the top players, which sounds like a waste of time, but it turns out that he was learning all kinds of cool things, including how others wrote macros to automate aspects of the game, and about things like hacking and blogging and keylogging etc. Meanwhile, he wanted his hardware side to catch up to his software side, so he decided to build a computer. I don’t mean plug and play components; I mean build a computer. So he hung out with the computer guys some more – a school person might call this an “internship” but basically it was hanging out – and he asked many questions and got them to help him think about what he needed and how it would all work together and then he went to a computer store and worked out some shop time and tool time and built a computer in their back room in exchange for doing some sweeping and phone answering. High tech meets low tech and vice versa because one needs shop time and the other needs somebody with a broom.
The less techie of those older kids went a slightly different route with it, writing articles for online and print magazines about technology based partly on his brother’s game designs. He was not the kind to do tech to the detailed extent of brother, but he did refine his understanding by writing about it.
By the way, I did not require ANY of the above work and none of it was called homework.
I also do not require “technology” work of my last kid left at home, who has discovered digital art and animation. He is 11 and searches for new products that will enhance his digital art-making ability. He reads the specs and reviews and then saves his pennies for what he wants. He has time to explore.
ok different topic
We are working thru some stereotypes here, so let’s go for another one. I understand that some people feel they absolutely cannot homeschool because they must work and that homeschooling is elitist and only available to high income. First of all, I heard these arguments just about being a stay at home mom, and yet I knew SAHMs who somehow made it work on very small family income. They did not have second cars and so on that some people take for granted as the things they HAVE to work for.
This is the same for homeschoolers. Ok, so the median might be higher. Yes, I know a homeschool mom who has household help and money for childcare and whatever camps and lessons her kids want to attend. But I also know happily homeschooling families who are surviving on very little – mom makes being at home pay, by cooking from scratch, growing and preserving food, shopping at thrift stores, and taking in work – from medical transcription to editing to sewing to child care for others. And I also know parents who both work to make a living and they tag team the homeschooling/child care. They are very frugal and CHOOSE to make spending time with their children a priority even though if they did not they could work more and earn more. I know people who homeschool “successfully” and live in a double-wide and people who homeschool “successfully” and live in a 6 bedroom 4,500 sq ft house. And they go to the same homeschool group, LOL. And by the way, the doublewide family has two computers that they got from Goodwill and learned a ton of tech as they got them up and running with help from their geeky friends. No, they don’t have Vista — which they point out is probably a good thing.
Homeschooling is probably only truly out of reach for a much smaller segment of people than is understood.
One other
I think that one reason homeschoolers may be defensive is that there is little understanding that homeschooling is a LIFESTYLE. This is very different from the school approach to education. Learning does not stop and start in a homeschool family — you are talking about our bedtime routines (reading), our car trips (audiobooks in the CD player), our chess games (logic building), our banking (financial management skills), etc. We are not in any kind of start/stop mode that is comparable to school. No bell rings. This is truer for some families than others — as unschoolers, we do not have a set curriculum even. This all sounded crazy to many people until my first kid in college made the deans list without ever having taken so much as a standardized test his entire high school career. In fact – let this freak people out – my kids have also not taken the ACT or SAT!
So, yes, I can sort of understand your curiousity, but you’ll have to forgive me for not having reciprocal curiousity. I know the routine about how you have to take/teach certain classes and certain tests or you’ll never get anywhere — from the schooled world. But it turns out not to be true!
I am very curious about education policy issues and also am always interested in hearing suggestions for helpful resources and teaching activities related to topics we are studying in our homeschool. But a lot of what a traditional classroom teacher spends his/her time doing simply isn’t relevant to my experience as a home educator.
Your question is akin to the head of foodservice at some big institution such as a hospital asking a mom cooking for her own family, “aren’t you curious about what I do so that you can improve your own meals?” There’s just such a big difference in scale and other factors that there’s only a limited amount of transferability.
I have questions like, How do you balance being both parent and teacher to your child?
I’ve never seen a dichotomy there.
How do you incorporate technology into your lessons?
1. I expect my children to type roughly half of their written work and publish all their essays and reports using Microsoft Word.
2. We use texts on CD, such as a Latin language CD that goes with our Cambridge Latin and a few story hour CDs that are a small part of our History Through Literature Course.
3. We occasionally use movies to spice up the curriculum, but only when they are completely relevant. We sometimes use short video files we download off the INTERNET to explain concepts in Science or give an example of a performance artist’s work.
4. Many of the kids’ workbooks are sold to us on CDs. We find printing exactly what we need to be more efficient than purchasing traditional workbooks.
5. We buy most of our curriculum on line from “homeschool swaps”, at roughly 60% the retail cost. We sell back what we no longer need in order to buy what we do.
6. We network with other homeschoolers on line.
How do you go about teaching a subject you know very little about?
My eldest child is just entering 8th grade. There is very little she needs to know that I can’t prepare to teach after a modest review. That being said, everything she does, I do first. That’s how I insure I’m fully prepared.
How much homework do you give? Is it even called ‘homework’ when it’s assigned at home?
If my children waste their time during “school hours”, the work that remains is “homework”. This is a powerful incentive to stay focused and get their work done. “Homework” is incredibly rare.
Do your students have to take the same standardized tests as mine?
In the state of VA the kids must take a nationally normed achievement test. We use the ITBS.
If so, how much test prep do you do each week?
We don’t. These tests only address a tiny fraction of the material we cover in a year. We can’t afford to waste a lot of time on it. I put my kids through the “Scoring High” ITBS preparatory program two weeks before the ITBS. If there’s an area that’s clearly a problem, we work on it the week before the ITBS. By then the kids’ public schooled friends are on half days or have begun their break. We go to half days too, so we can all celebrate the joys of Summer together. That’s it.
In short, I want to know your best (and worst) practices.
The best thing about home schooling is the flexibility to choose curriculum and adapt it to the child’s needs. The worst thing about home schooling is that it’s easy to become distracted and fail to dedicate enough time to education.
And as homeschool teachers, aren’t you just as curious about the life of a public school teacher?
I was educated to be a public school teacher. I spent quite a bit of time teaching before I had kids. After they went to school, I volunteered constantly. When I rejoin the workforce, it won’t be as a public school teacher. I thought is was a very unpleasant job.
If for nothing else, to rethink and reshape your own teaching philosophies? Most teachers get nasty when they find out I home school. I do have one friend who is gracious. I am grateful to her, because she lets me borrow some books I can use to teach History through Literature.
In the first year I home schooled, the kids’ curriculums looked almost exactly like a typical public school’s curriculum. I was dissatisfied. It didn’t address either child’s educational needs.
The second year I bought a “canned” home school curriculum. It was a bit workbook intensive, and we found ourselves frantically and blindly racing through workbooks. Half way through the year I finally got the guts to write each child’s curriculum. I had to do something. We were very burned out. It was very rewarding, but nothing like public school.
The kids now have a curriculum that integrates all their core subjects. They do their Language Arts in Science and Social Studies. They perform much of their Math in Science and Social Studies. They read great books throughout their school hours, write essays each day and research papers each week. They do Science Experiments at their Co-op, and any time they feel like it. I don’t know what to say about this to a public school teacher. It’s nothing like any public school I’ve heard of. It’s home school.
Alistair, I answer your question, how do you teach subjects in which you have little familiarity and no expertise. But first, I disagree with you that Jesse’s entire post and its subsequent comments were a giant yawn and aside from all those homeschoolers, most readers simply tuned out.
I too was unable to read all the comments, there were so many of them, but I intend to. It may take a week to get through all of them and I’m saving them up for when I’m not so consumed by work these two weeks. I can hardly wait to read all of them.
You did ask a pointed question. How do homeschooling parents teach areas in which they are weak or have little knowledge and experience? It’s an important question but it does show how out of touch you and Jesse are. Are you both completely clueless about the explosion of curriculum and resources out there? I call it the major paradigm shift in education today. Public school officials think reform means raising test scores. To us homeschoolers, “reform” means completely redoing and rethinking the way we do education today and turning the existing zeitgeist completely on its head. Learn quickly, Jesse and Alistair, for you will discover many of your brightest most motivated students have fled the classroom.
So how do you teach areas you can’t? You farm it out! We homeschooled one year and a friend told me there are boatloads of curricula on the web alone, you just need to know where to find them.
Jesse also perpetuated a myth that you have to be fabulously wealthy to homeschool. I too initially presumed our meager finances could not support it and I delayed the decision for three years. Those were three critical years I lost and I’m still kicking myself over it.
We homeschooled on a shoe string budget but yes, we did shell out some bucks for three on-line Johns Hopkins University-Center for Talented Youth courses. We dipped into our IRA for those, I’m crazy that way. That’s how important my child’s education is to me. But the rest we did on the cheap and took advantage of every free museum, lecture, exhibit, and outdoor arts event my area had to offer.
Distance learning, on line and boxed curricula available to homeschool families will radically alter the educational landscape in this country. Just think: you can either send your child to school where she will likely be denied recess, spend her day on test prep with mountains of homework when she arrives home, cutting severely into her sleep, if she is gifted she will be expected to be the teacher’s unofficial aide, helping the struggling students. She will have no time to play, socialize or spend time with her family.
That’s choice #1. Or she can be homeschooled where she will arise when she is rested, eat when she is hungry, do her academics during her strongest part of the day, play for hours outdoors, have time to read voluminously, and spend weekends at museums and nature centers.
Given those choices, for parents who can and have the inclination, why on earth would they choose the former?
You write: And as homeschool teachers, aren’t you just as curious about the life of a public school teacher? If for nothing else, to rethink and reshape your own teaching philosophies?
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Am I curious about the life of public school teachers? I know how many of them teach, my daughter was in public school for three years before I pulled her out for a one year sabbatical. She began in private school.
What I saw in those three public school years didn’t exactly knock my socks off. It was supposed to be a gifted program, a vaunted one, but all I saw was the regular program with a whole lot of extra homework thrown in to make it look gifted. I finally concluded I could do it better.
That’s not to say there aren’t some good public school teachers out there, legions in fact. But the test machine drives everything, no matter how “good” the school is reputed to be. Once an entire school’s ethos and curriculum is controlled by a bunch of end of year tests, you’re fated to doom, no matter how you spin it. If you are crafty, you can get around the earthquake but not unscathed. I prefer to dodge the earthquake by choosing homeschooling.
No matter how hard teachers try, it just seemed to me that so much of the day was wasted. Now that she’s back at school, I’d love an honest intellectual curious discussion about why so much of the day is squandered. This is my daughter’s life, her precious school years. Why is everything sent home?
My daughter would come home in 7th grade, weary, a backpack stuffed with hours of homework and and after peeking through all her materials, I still wasn’t sure just what had happened at school that day. Yes, she took tests, yes, they sometimes went over homework, yes, the work at home was graded at school. All I know is she taught Algebra I to herself each afternoon, leaving me to conclude we’d be better off if we homeschooled and bought the Johns Hopkins University-Center for Talented Youth geometry course for 8th.
What Judith says here is spot-on as far as I’m concerned:
“No matter how hard teachers try, it just seemed to me that so much of the day was wasted. Now that she’s back at school, I’d love an honest intellectual curious discussion about why so much of the day is squandered. This is my daughter’s life, her precious school years. Why is everything sent home?”
That is the single most crazy-making thing about sending a child to public school. How on earth can they waste that much time? Considering how little they’ve accomplished all day, why aren’t they embarrassed to expect so much to be done in the evening? Is there no sense of shame there?
When I think about it, I remember what is was like to parent during those miserable evenings, and I start to twitch!
Our work is done for the day, we’re headed for the Zoo again. We’ve got a great family evening planned. It has been a great day. This is why we homeschool.
Elizabeth, THANK YOU for that validation. That’s it, in a nutshell. When I pulled my daughter out, I told everyone my primary motives were homework overload and sleep deprivation (the first often caused the second). But the list branched out from there to include re-igniting that passion for learning, discovery and curiosity. I was alarmed that my eager inquisitive hungry child was burned out at the ripe old age of twelve.
Yes, Elizabeth, if I had to pare it down to the barest of essentials, that was it. Enormous time completely wasted at school with nary an apology. Then the teachers have not only the gall to send it all home but to chastise and punish children who can’t get it all done in the few hours after school, somewhere between dinner and bedtime. It’s maddening and was my chief reason for homeschooling and my chief regret for not having done it sooner.
Please, Alistair and Jesse, tell me why so much time is wasted and why SO little really gets done at school. Please. Talk to me, I really need an answer. You cannot pull the eyes over would-be homeschoolers are still in your classes, we are watching, concerned (yes, we care) and we’d love an explanation.
If you tell us it’s because the classes are too large, the ability levels too diverse (not an excuse here, my daughter was in programs for highly gifted students), you are bound against your will by standardized test prep, politicians with no educational experience are calling the shots, your students come from impoverished homes, you don’t get paid enough, you have too much to cram in, you don’t have enough supplies, you don’t have enough money, the kids are restless and wiggly, there are too many useless school assemblies that eat up time, too many ineffective “health” programs that further cut into your day, too many student oral reports that go on for days and days, too many quizzes and tests that cut into precious learning time, too many papers to grade, too much busy work to mark up; if those are your excuses for not making the most of the hours we send our children to you, then I’d say both of you made the best case for homeschooling! We couldn’t have said it better!
Judith,
I hate the unkindness in most discussions comparing home school to public school, yet questions like ours beg to be answered.
Every time I think about those miserable years we spent dealing with the public school, I become exasperated all over again.
I volunteered most days, and yet even I couldn’t tell you where the time went. I just know that it did.
Just to be clear about this once more. I support your decision to homeschool. Public schools are all kinds of messed up, and if you possess the means at home to do a better job on your own, then you should have the freedom to do that.
On all the wasted time: First, I think ‘wasted time’ is relative. What is wasted time to one student might be the one thing another student remembers from the entire year. Plus, good public school teachers don’t want to waste time. Sometimes things happen that must be addressed before continuing with the curriculum. Classroom management, for example, is a huge timesuck. But, of course, it’s absolutely necessary and part of the character development of a student and indisputedly more important than learning how to do algebra (but will not be tested, and so in that respect, is wasted time).
I don’t know. As I write this, I get the feeling that your question was rhetorical. In the following paragraph, you propose your own (mostly accurate) answers. You know why time gets wasted in public schools. You don’t need to hear it from me. As a devoted public school teacher, I’m not trying to pull the wool over the eyes of would-be homeschoolers. Read some of the other posts on this blog from public schoolteachers. We want to fix this mess.
Alistair
But, of course, it’s [classroom management] absolutely necessary and part of the character development of a student and indisputedly more important than learning how to do algebra (but will not be tested, and so in that respect, is wasted time).
But it’s not absolutely necessary for the students who were minding their manners and waiting for the lesson to begin and who already knew how to behave without that lesson. They are punished for the disruptions of others, and their learning time has been stolen from them. It’s an issue of…. equity, if you will.
Of course. And it would create even more inequity if I didn’t stop the class to handle the management issue. In that way, it is absolutely necessary. The students who do want to learn are looking at me, thinking, “Yo, deal with that.”
Equity is an ideal. It’s what we’re working towards.
Teacherrevised,
The “relative importance of Algebra” is where I stop feeling angry, and start feeling sad.
This week I’m preparing my kids to take the ITBS. It’s a somewhat slack week, a series of 5 “mental health days”.
One of the things that’s made me a bit nervous has been my awareness that while my daughter has been studying Algebra all year, she will be tested on “7th Grade Math and Arithmetic Computation”. Frankly, 7th Grade Math and Arithmetic Computation are harder to master than Algebra. If she’s forgotten a significant portion of it, then she’ll bomb that section of the ITBS.
To my delight, a brief refresher was all that was required for peace of mind. It’s going to be fine. This year’s “gamble” paid off.
(As you’ve pointed out, home school parents are risk takers. We gamble. You’re right about this. What you fail to grasp are the stakes, and the care with which we weigh the odds.)
Because my education is intensive in Logic, Science and Mathematics, I consider Algebra to be a vital skill. Bluntly, if a student hasn’t mastered Algebra, then a Bachelor of Science Degree is impractical. There are a broad range of concepts that simply cannot be mastered without Algebra.
I don’t want to begin limiting my child’s options in adult life at the tender age of 12. For this reason, I take the development of her Math skills very seriously.
When my kids were in public school, every day was a hootenanny. Managing the misbehavior of 2 or 3 students took most of the teachers’ attention. The rest of their energies were absorbed in getting students to pass the standardized tests.
Under conditions like that, my daughter never could have mastered Algebra this year. First and foremost, she needs a teacher who has time for her. After that, she needs a bit of peace and quiet.
She also needs a teacher who’s ready to put her education first, and gamble on the results of the standardized test at the end of the year.
Who is invested enough in my daughter’s education to teach her what she needs to know to succeed in life, rather than merely pass the next standardized test? Who has the time to dedicate to her, and a learning environment that meets her needs?
She’s like most kids in the public school system. Her needs are typical, her ability is typical. It’s an unrecognized national disaster that girls like her can’t be taught Algebra in 7th grade at the local public school.
The consequences of this disaster will be felt for generations.
Regarding time wasted — what is the single commodity that you can NEVER get more of, never get back? Time. We have a finite number of days — an unknown number, really (and I personally prefer not to know what’s left in that bank account!), and you suggest it is okay to make some people waste that commodity while twiddling their thumbs listening to explanations that they understood days, or more, ago? That the inefficiency that you admit to in the public school system is okay? Just because, what, they are “age deficient” to use a snarky pc term.
I would rather see more children learn more efficiently, and give them that extra time to pursue what drives them. Yes, some students need more time to learn a concept, some less. And it may be different in another subject.
That’s why, imo, we need to rethink HOW we educate all children. It’s as unfair for the struggling child to have to hurry along and not master the concept, as it is to the advanced child who has to learn to deal with literally being bored out of his or her mind.
There has to be a better approach. And, until we find one that we can implement to a larger segment of society, those who are so inclined can and should remove their children from a system designed to be “one size fits all” (which rarely fits anyone well) to a custom fit at home.
I read a comment that assured us that homeschooled children cannot excel in science.
Countering that stereotype, a fourteen-year-old homeschooler from Virginia was just named one of three Best in Show winners and awarded a $50,000 scholarship at the Intel International Science and Engineering Fair in Reno, NV. Competing against 1,563 contestants from 56 countries, regions and territories, she won for her research that “identified and classified the evolutionary relationships between sweat bees and the nematodes (microscopic worms) that live inside them.”
I just watched her articulately explain her project on youtube.
And I happen to know the girl Jeanne references!
“How do you balance being both parent and teacher to your child? ”
I don’t see them as being two different things. As a parent it is my job to be the teacher of my children . If my children attended a public or private school I would still be their teacher whenever they were with me. That became my job the day that they were born.
You see, it’s my philosophy that learning isn’t something that a person does for x number of years and then it’s finished. Learning is life. Life is learning. You are learning from the day you are born until you die. My job is to make sure that they have the opportunity to learn all they can about everything.
How do you incorporate technology into your lessons? The computer, DVD’ player, library, etc. are our friends. We are constantly searching up answers to questions on the internet. Using the computer to seek out attractions/activities in our areas, etc. Learning all that we can about modern technology is very important to us.
“How do you go about teaching a subject you know very little about?”
We learn together. The perfect example to my children that learning is a life-long activity. Also we seek out experts on what we are learning. For example my 10 yo wants to learn all that he can about WWW2. I was not there but we have been checking out books on WWW II and he got to interview a WWW2 veteran. We do that with all areas that I feel inadequate to teach.
As an adult, I often need to seek out experts on areas that I need more knowledge in. For example, I love gardening and have garden for many years but even so there are those that know more about gardening that I. If I run into a problem. I consult them. I do the same with homeschooling and in doing that I am teaching my children how to be a lifelong learner and seek answers to questions that they may have.
“How much homework do you give? Is it even called ‘homework’ when it’s assigned at home?”
At the moment, I don’t give them any “homework” but my oldest is 10 so that may change as they get older.
“Do your students have to take the same standardized tests as mine? If so, how much test prep do you do each week? In short, I want to know your best (and worst) practices.”
Yes, according to our state laws we have to test our children in 3rd, 5th, and 8th grades. I do know test prep. For me it’s not important how well they do on a test but how much they retain from their studies. I think that tests are not the best why to see what a child knows. Rather I think having them tell you orally about the subject is a better way to see what they retained.
“And as homeschool teachers, aren’t you just as curious about the life of a public school teacher?”
They are wonderful caring people who work very hard to teach other peoples children. They are also very supportive of me as I teach my children.
Not really, my mom is a public school teacher, as are several of my great aunts, 3 of my aunts, and some of my best friends.
“If for nothing else, to rethink and reshape your own teaching philosophies?”
My family members and friends who teach public school are wonderful and supportive of me but teaching public school and homeschooling are very different from each other. I do rethink and reshape my teaching philosophies but what has helped me in that area has been reading the writings of Dr. Raymond and Dorothy Moore, John Taylor Gatto, Dr. Ruth Beechick, Charlotte Mason, etc. After reading their writings (which are very different from each other, BTW) I was able to form my own philosophy that fit my family and students the best.
I also help reading homeschooling magazines, attending conferences and homeschooling support groups very helpful as well.
“some of my best friends”
That was supposed to read 2 of my closest friends. Sorry about that.
“some of my best friends”
That was supposed to read 2 of my closest friends. Sorry about that.
@Alastair – “That’s not what I was referring to when I said some of the responses condemned other choices. I meant comments like … and “in [public] school, the main goal is control and conformity.”
In saying that, I wasn’t condemning other choices, just describing the nature of institutional schooling, back in my day and today.* The notion that schools are designed to control children is one I picked up from hearing a lecture by John Taylor Gatto (mentioned several times above), a former NYC and NYS teacher of the year who used his bully pulpit to talk about the problems with schools, based on his years in the classroom.
BTW, I became interested in the concept of homeschooling before I ever had children — based upon years of boredom in school and the realization that I learned more and produced more interesting work on my own time than I ever did in the classroom. Gatto talks about needing privacy to be creative, and how students in school can’t escape the watchful, intruding eye of teachers and other students. Do you think he’s wrong?
*I spent a few months last year substituting in multiple districts in my area. Several times “my students” got in trouble when I let them talk quietly in the halls, or read ahead in the novel the class was studying. In several high school classes I found students who didn’t bother doing that day’s work because they had “already failed” that class and were just killing time until summer school. Then there was the period I was asked to watch the in-school suspension room — half a dozen bored, depressed kids sitting there in absolute silence, waiting for the day to end. (If I did that to my kids at home, it’d be considered child abuse.) To my way of thinking, these types of behavior are totally about control and keeping the students from getting ahead of the rest of the class, or the teacher.
“I don’t have much patience for that kind of a discussion. ”
Then I would like to constructively suggest that you reconsider Jesse’s posting privileges, or at least condition them on regular tox screens.
A link to Jesse’s post led me here, and I’m unfamiliar with your blog, but if this post of yours is any indication of the tone you’re trying to maintain, it doesn’t help to grant authoring rights to someone who would willingly present the type of incoherent, poorly reasoned screed to the public that Jesse did. That post did more to discredit the teaching profession than anything I’ve read in years.
“Public school teachers aren’t competing with homeschool teachers,”
Yes, they are, and if you stopped to contemplate the reality of economics, you’d realize that. Part of your misperception stems from the fact that public school teachers are unionized, and as such have engaged in the economic distortion of agreeing NOT to compete with each other.
How exactly are public school teachers competing with homeschool teachers? I don’t see it.
Alistair
The same way Ford workers compete with GM workers. Every kid being homeschooled is one fewer student in the public school. Lower headcount means less state funding, and fewer teaching jobs in the school. The same way, when I cut my own lawn, I’m denying the landscaper business, When you do something for money, you’re in competition with every other person who does it.
Please see the above linked website for my response to you. Though I use wordpress myself, I don’t want to lose the formatting in transfer.
Though if you wish not to click through, here it is in full(your questions are asteriked):
*********As a public school teacher who knows very little about homechooling, I would love to know what it takes to be a good homeschool teacher. I have questions like, How do you balance being both parent and teacher to your child?
As you have been answered on your blog by many, I will state the same: Parenting does not end once teaching begins. They are truly one in the same. I have both parented my girls from birth as well as taught them, from birth, everything needed to create healthy young children who began their young lives in the public school realm. But since this question was asked with sincerity, I wish to ask you one with the same: Does your teaching stop just because you are also a parent? Or better still, do you stop teaching just because “school’s out for summer?” If you truly can answer ‘yes’ to either question, then I would dare suggest you have failed as both a parent and as a teacher. One truly cannot be separated from the other. Just because some people do not go on to teach within a brick-and-mortar school realm, does not mean they aren’t teachers. And just because one is a parent does not mean he cannot be a teacher, either. Teachers are found in all professions, though we may call them “supervisors” or “bosses” or “Human Resource Counselors”. Their job, like yours, does not end simply because they leave the building. They must go home to “supervise” or “boss” or even “Counsel” a family as well. They lack no less skill at doing so simply because they choose to do it at home as well as at work.
*****How do you incorporate technology into your lessons?
You cannot be serious with this question? You claim to be sincere in your seeking of knowledge, yet you ask the most stupid question I have ever heard. Tell me, do you also ask your wife how she can cook if she lacks a stove? Surely you know that one does not need a stove to cook, right? Yes, it makes our lives that much more convenient, but it isn’t a necessity needed to cook. However, in the interest of fairness, I’ll answer your question: While I will concede to the fact that there are some homeschoolers who may live in modified caves without television, they aren’t completely unhooked from the rest of the world. Why, in my own home I have :
3 desktop computers (and one broken one)
2 laptops
4 Nintendo DS systems
an Xbox
an Xbox360
all the Playstations
a Wii
a full surround sound stereo system
4 DVD players–one with the capability to not only copy VHS (WOW!) but also burn DVD’s as well
2 huge flat screen televisions
3 regular televisions
3 iPODS
4 cell phones
and get this: I even have an overhead projection system!
Holy Shit Batman! I don’t actually live in a cave! Admittedly, we’ve been blessed more than most, but I can assure you that even the staunchest “no television, ever!” (say it to the tune of “No more wire hangers, ever!) is technologically capable of teaching technology to their kids. Of course, since you asked how I actually incorporate it into my lessons, I could tell you all that I have done with any of the above, but I think it is fair to say that I don’t own this stuff for looks. However, I will give you just one example, a simple one: DVD courses used to teach a subject that incorporate sight, sound, and ability to sit still for 30 minutes while taking notes. That, in and of itself, can possibly wipe out SEVEN things on my list (depending on what kind of DVD I am using). Now isn’t that just spiffy?
******How do you go about teaching a subject you know very little about?
Admittedly, weaknesses do exist, even in (gasp! horror!) teachers. I have a weakness for Foreign Language. It truly is a travesty, though, that I can’t figure out how to use one of my non-technologically created pieces of equipment to find a way to teach such a difficult subject, isn’t it? Snark aside, the truth is, this is also a dumb question. For one to claim so much education behind him without being able to show he actually uses said education, truly shows the arrogance of teachers, doesn’t it? Really, thinking before you speak is one of the lessons in logic, or did you miss that class? Truth is, what I cannot “teach”, my husband can. What he and I won’t or can’t teach, it’s a good thing there are companies out there who make it easy for us to want to teach it, yes? Plus, co-oping is a good thing (for some) and many use it. I find it too much like the public school experience and I choose to find alternative methods, such as what I described above, to “teach” a subject I know very little about. It’s amazing the plethora of stuff that’s out there.
******How much homework do you give? Is it even called ‘homework’ when it’s assigned at home?
Well, since the very definition of “homework” is “work done at home”, I would assume all we DO is “homework”. However, no, I don’t give ‘extra’ assignments to be done after I have finished teaching for that day. The very reason homework exists is to keep the student busy, at home, with mind numbing and sometimes completely unrelated, pieces of paper just to prove you’ve taught them something that day. Since I don’t have to prove this to anyone, my proof lies within the pudding. And since I can make some damn good pudding, I think my proof suffices.
*****Do your students have to take the same standardized tests as mine? If so, how much test prep do you do each week?
Yes and no. Since the very reason your students are failing is because of those standardized tests, why would I want the same for mine? The FCAT is a laughable farce of a test and proves nothing to anyone except to educrats who think they know how to teach. Now, to be sure, each state has different standards for what can be done to prove to them you are actually doing it. I am thankful that in my state, I have the option of choosing the umbrella option and using a private school as my covering, for which no standardized test of any kind is required to “prove” I am actually “teaching”. Especially since I don’t teach anything remotely similar to what is being “tested”. What I teach far surpasses that. We do utilize the IOWA test, having found it to be a decent (slightly) way to show us exactly where our children stand. We also chose the SAT/ACT and PSAT as our standard as well. Just for good measure I have a now 8th grader, who when she took the PSAT last year, scored in and above the 10th grade level.
Homeschooling just stinks, though, doesn’t it?
As for how much test prep I do a week? Maybe if you guys quit focusing on “test prep” and actually, you know, TAUGHT, these kids might learn something. And something useful at that, instead of “study, memorize, forget”. No, I spend exactly one week on test prep–the week before, teaching them strategies on how to take the SAT (I can’t believe you need a strategy to pass a general knowledge test). Any more than that, and I become like you.
*****In short, I want to know your best (and worst) practices.
We do not need “practices” to be able to teach sir. If you are practicing, you can’t very well be called a teacher then, can you? I have standards by which I teach my girls and by which I want them to learn, none of which I practice. The world is our chalkboard, our library, our teacher. One walk outside, out back even, and I can teach them a plethora of things, all things more credible to the over all learning experience than what one would learn in the square fishbowl called a classroom.
****And as homeschool teachers, aren’t you just as curious about the life of a public school teacher? If for nothing else, to rethink and reshape your own teaching philosophies?
Irrelevant to the discussion and a bit of a straw man at that. No, I do not want to be curious about the life of a public school teacher, especially not if the goal is to reshape or rethink my own teaching philosophies. Why would I want to model educating my own children after that which does not work? No, my own teaching philosophies are guided by my kid’s educational abilities, wants, and needs. I may use the guides given for a four-year track high school graduate and issue credits based on that, but that’s only because the educrats refuse to see homeschooling as a legitimate and viable way of teaching. And let’s not forget that my husband is himself a teacher. A very in-demand one due to his background and degree. I STILL do not want to model my philosophies after his. What he wants and needs for his classroom of 30 are not his nor my wants or needs for our “classroom” of two.
Really, since you claim that this argument is laughable and getting old, why continue the fodder? I am NOT trying to take your job away. No educrat is going to come knocking on my door and say to me “Mrs. Wilson, since you are such a wonderful teacher, would you come take over Mr. X’s job and teach in his place?” I am also unlikely to get a teaching job based solely on my experience as a homeschooler. So why the worry guys? Honest, we ain’t all out to get you.
I swear.
Toni
I’m not sure about your tone, Toni. I don’t think sarcasm has any place on a board that’s all about homeschool teachers and public teachers feeling the love. Of course, I say that as the previous sarcastic post, about which I got a complaint.
I really think the one thing public teachers (or anyone else for that matter) doesn’t realize is that we homeschoolers get very tired of having to justify ourselves over and over and over again. Every time someone asks me, “Aren’t you worried about socialization?” I sigh and think, “Not again. Haven’t we settled this yet?”
I suppose the argument could be made that we have made a choice that is out of the mainstream, and therefore we must be prepared to defend our choice to the mainstream. Except that when we do, they tell us to stop being defensive! Go figure.
I think that I personally have less patience with the whole thing because my first child was born with clubfoot. After being approached in every store for months by some well-meaning busybody who thought they had a right to know why my daughter was wearing casts and what my plan was to make sure she would grow up “normal,” I have little tolerance for people who want me to answer their questions so they can feel comfortable with my decisions. Some people call that defensive, I call it, “It’s really none of your business.”
Shevrae, since you pointed out that my “tone” was sarcastic, I will, again, point out that this was not started by me or any other homeschooler. And, as you also said, I get very tired of hearing these repetitive arguments. VERY.
If public schooling were such a wonderful beast, private nor home schools would ever exist. Period.
And I would call my post less “sarcastic” and more “blunt”.
I would love to be able to write that one final post, blog, etc. that nails these mindless, repetitive questions into the coffin one final time. Just once I would love to see a teacher honestly admit we aren’t trying to take their jobs, not now not ever; and while we may do a better job for *our children*, most of us do truly recognize the good teachers that do exist. I don’t care what statistics say, not all of us fit neatly into that “religious, white, rich, homeschooling-for-Jesus” mold.
I am getting the notifications for new posts, but they aren’t showing. Interesting.
toni
Interesting question you raise, and I see I’m not the only one who taught in the public schools before deciding to homeschool my kids. My answer to it all is…there’s no one answer for every child, and you, as a teacher, know it. There’s even a phrase for it when the public school system writes a kid off- she or he “fell through the cracks”. Shame, shame, shame that such a phrase even exists. Deeper shame that not every child who enters public school graduates and goes on to top colleges and a happy, productive, successful life. But they don’t, and that’s reality, so I chose a different path for my kids. I graduated from public school and did quite well for myself but I like having other options for my children. My oldest is 15 and she’s the most amazing person I know, and she wouldn’t be that way if not homeschooled. I don’t know what she would be like, but I know she would be different, and I wouldn’t change her for anything, so as far as I’m concerned the proof is in the pudding. I know there are homeschooled children out there who would be better off in “regular” school, but there are also children in regular school who would be better off homeschooled, and that’s a pure and simple fact.
As for your “homeschoolers are geeks” argument, that one doesn’t hold any water whatsoever since plenty of “geeky” kids are churned out by the public schools every year. Very few public school graduates have the social skills you claim they will learn in that setting. If they all developed those skills the cheerleading squad would contain every girl in the school, there wouldn’t be any bullying, and all of the kids would be happy and well adjusted. Yeah.
One final note- please guard against arrogance. I don’t know you personally but it’s something our profession (speaking as a certified teacher, not a homeschooler) suffers from. I saw it all the time in the public schools- that “I know what’s better for your kids because I’m a trained professional” attitude. I’m sorry, but you do not, in fact, know what’s better for my kids. I’ve known them since they were in the womb; I know who they are, what their learning styles are, and every nuance of their being. Even if they were in your class you can not possibly develop the knowledge of who they are that I have developed in the short amount of time, a year at most, that you will come in contact with them. Get over yourself, please. (And I mean that in the most respectful way.)
Actually, no, I’m not at all curious about the life of a public school teacher. My mother was one for over 20 years. I have taught in public school, too.
The MOST frequent former profession of homeschooling parents? TEACHER.
Funny thing, that, that more teachers than people of any other profession believe that homeschooling is the best choice for their kids.
The only REAL drawback of homeschooling? Doing it well takes hard work and a lot of sacrifices. Not everyone can do that–or cares do.
Fortunately, many people can find quite acceptable institutional alternatives. But if public schooling were even equal to homeschooling, I’d never be doing this.
Toni,
The notifications might be for comments that are nested further up the list. Mine are nesting in the original (waiting for Alistair to find and answer them).
–Jen
And as homeschool teachers, aren’t you just as curious about the life of a public school teacher? If for nothing else, to rethink and reshape your own teaching philosophies?
Most homeschoolers are graduates from public schools, so it’s not like we’ve never met any public school teachers. A fairly large percentage of homeschoolers actually have been public school teachers or are married to somebody who teaches public school. I know several from my local homeschool support group.
My mother was a public school teacher (high school business and English courses). She still substitutes (she’s 69) on occasion. She thanks me constantly for homeschooling her grandchildren.
My dad had many career hats- preacher, insurance salesman, social worker, and private school administrator and teacher. He used to substitute regularly, too- they mostly called him to help in the class where the emotionally disturbed children were sequestered. My cousin is a public school teacher. So were both my grandparents. I was going to be a special ed teacher and took college courses toward that end.
So while there may be and undoubtedly are individual teachers I might learn from, that will be because of the gifts and skills of those individual human beings, not because I have no exposure to public schools and their teachers.
And now, from a homeschool mom who is not, and never was a certified teacher, who has no certified teachers in her family, and who attended a private, not public, school as a kid.
Alistair: “I would love to know what it takes to be a good homeschool teacher.”
Linda: It takes being a good parent! And it takes a love of learning, creativity, patience, a certain degree of self confidence, a willingness to question the status quo (think outside the box), and the type of personality that enjoys spending a lot of time with one’s own children.
Alistair: “How do you balance being both parent and teacher to your child?”
Linda: Many parents have already answered that there is no conflict/dichotomy between the two. But I would like to add that I think the question itself arises from the problems that can arise when a public (or private) school teacher has her own child in the class. In a school, it creates problems when the teacher loves one child in the class more than all the others; when the child has access to the teacher after school, that the rest of the kids don’t have; when the teacher might actually expect *more* of her own child than of the rest of the class; when test scores and grades are an issue.
Homeschool moms/dads aren’t teaching classrooms full of kids. Our teaching isn’t done for money. We don’t have to answer to a school administration that doesn’t know or care about our children, or use poor curriculum choices, or follow a teaching schedule that doesn’t work well for our own family. Homeschool parents have a whole world of choices in terms of curricula (including not using a curriculum, per se, at all), subject matter, and methods.
Furthermore, teaching and learning do not have to be done in a way that resembles school at all. Children do not need to be “taught at” in order to learn. Some parents do teach in a schoolish way, but many others don’t. (Picture a mom and two kids sitting together on a sofa, taking turns reading aloud to each other; the mom explains new vocabulary words to the kids, or they take turns looking new words up in the dictionary or online; they talk about the book’s plot and themes, the author’s style and probable personality and world-view, as evidenced by the characters and events in the story; the mom and kids relate aspects of fiction – history, sociology, geography, science – to the real world. They’re curious about the author, and go look up a biography online. The book is a sci-fi book and mentions fascinating cosmic phenomena, such as comets and “Oort Clouds”; they look up articles about these phenomena online, and then the mother and kids go to the library and take out some books about space. This was a large part of homeschooling for our family, when my kids were younger.)
I think that the more a parent respects her/his children, and cares what they’re interested in, what they want, and how they feel, the less there is any conflict. Not only between parenting and teaching, but between parents and children altogether.
Alistair: “How do you incorporate technology into your lessons?”
Linda: You’ve heard a lot about educational technology from other parents by now. I would just like to add that, in addition to being a family of computer geeks (and proud of it), we use t.v. shows and DVD movies and documentaries a LOT. There are SO many good programs on PBS, as well as on various cable channels. (We can’t afford cable t.v. anymore, but when we had it, we learned more than I could ever list from programs on Animal Planet, the History Channel, Discovery Channel, etc.) We also use Netflix as a never-ending source of educational DVDs. We watch documentaries, historical movies, old movies that show my kids what life and society were like in recent-past decades, Shakespeare plays, and dance and musical performances.
The part of your question that really does not apply to my family’s homeschooling is “lessons”. All of life is a learning experience, and we incorporate whatever technology can afford into all aspects of our lives.
Alistair: “How do you go about teaching a subject you know very little about?”
Linda: Like the others who answered this, I either learn with my kids, use an online or video course, or find them a class or tutor. (But I always loved learning, did really well in high school, speak two foreign languages, play and teach guitar and piano, am skilled at woodworking, and the kinds of things that my kids need to learn that I know very little about are not the academic stuff. On the other hand, they have taken a number of academic classes with our homeschool group just for the social aspect, and because there are other teachers who are more passionate about specific subjects than I am, and know better than I do how to make the subject fun and interesting. Aside from some academic classes, they have taken classes in sculpting, woodworking – even though I could have taught it, dance, karate, sports, art, and acting.)
Alistair: “How much homework do you give? Is it even called ‘homework’ when it’s assigned at home?”
Linda: The term “homework” doesn’t apply, in our case. The kids work independently on some subjects, but I wouldn’t call it “homework”, except when it was assigned by some other teacher. We never had “school time” and “not school time” at home, since we started homeschooling. The kids learn from many different activities throughout the day and evening.
Alistair: “Do your students have to take the same standardized tests as mine? If so, how much test prep do you do each week?”
Linda: No, I never gave my kids standardized tests. I know what my kids do and don’t know, and what their strengths and weaknesses are. My kids went to public school for the first 4 years, so they have encountered standardized tests in the past. My son chose to go back to public school starting in 10th grade, so he is back in the system and taking those tests regularly. My daughter is dyslexic, and has a.d.d. Standardized tests can not accurately gauge what a person with those learning disabilities really knows.
Alistair: “In short, I want to know your best (and worst) practices.”
Linda: The same practice that is “best” for my daughter is “worst” for my son. He chose to go back to public school, while my daughter is certain that she wants to homeschool through high school. I am very non-coercive, anti-authoritarian, democratically inclined, spontaneous, creative, and unstructured. Both of my kids were happy (and learning) in this environment for years. But then my son started wanting to spend more time with hordes of other teens and wanted more structure, while, at the same time, our financial situation worsened, so that we could no longer afford a lot of homeschool/private classes. Also, most of my son’s friends lived on the other side of town, and there is no public transportation near us. So going to visit a friend on the spur of the moment was seldom an option. When we lived in an apartment complex, there were always kids around to play with (after school, on weekends, and in the summer). But, just as my kids reached their teen years, we moved to a house in a neighborhood with very few kids my kids’ ages.
My daughter, on the other hand, tried public high school for a week, hated it, and chose homeschooling. A huge high school with thousands of kids is not a good place for a shy, introverted, learning disabled kid. And shyness/introvertedness, by the way, is a genetic trait. Going to school does not “cure” a person of these traits, any more than it “cures” people of dyslexia or a.d.d. It merely makes the kid feel like an oddball, lowers her self esteem, and in extreme cases, causes severe depression.
Testing, testing, testing…
For more on this fascinating topic (ha!), see Assessments and The Homeschooled Student at http://spedr.com/2clgd
I think it would be interesting to have someone write an article and call it “The Case for Homeschooling”.
Then again, I’ll readily admit that while the public school teachers do a decent amount of classroom management during their day, there is more to it than that. A LOT more to it than that, to be more precise.
Still doesn’t change the fact that we plan to homeschool our daughter. It goes along with the fact that I plan to take a few courses in teaching at my local community college to add to the Bachelor’s degree I already have (albeit, in a completely unrelated subject). Doesn’t mean that parents without the education can’t teach effectively, just that I want to make sure I know as much as possible to help my daughter learn all she needs to know.
Another way that some homeschoolers view “homework” is the work they’re expected to do around the house. A large group (not all) feel strongly about children pitching in their share for the family unit. Manual labor helps burn that energy, open the mind, and builds confidence and competency.
Some parents set up “school at home” while others try “unschooling” which basically means no formal instruction what so ever. The parents provide a rich environment and facilitate whatever the kids want to learn. I suspect most of us fall somewhere in the middle.
The best thing about homeschooling is the freedom. We can respond to our child’s interests when it is strong. It doesn’t matter if the unit is on dinosaurs. If he’s dying to learn about volcanoes, we can postpone dinosaurs and let him become an expert. You’d be surprised how much my 4 year old learned about anatomy b/c she was curious. I’d have never bothered teaching her that on my own.
Furthermore, we don’t usually try to cover as much material. We usually focus on teaching our children skills for a life time. We don’t have to keep to the calendar. If I have a new baby, academics may take a back seat for a few months. They might have to help mom more and we might not get as much done. But I suspect that learning how to care for the baby and helping out more around the house has plenty of valuable lessons. In time, it all works itself out.
I know for myself, my interests and motivations ebb and flow. This is natural. In homeschooling, you can tailor your lessons and projects to the child’s timing.
As for subject we don’t know, most of us can keep up with a child through middle school. By high school it can sometimes be a bit more challenging. If they already know more than we or grasp a subject more easily, we out source. There are always books and the net. There are also experts. Our kids who are crazy about science might offer their services to college profs in the lab room. They work for free and learn from top scientists. Or they can take junior college classes. There are lots of options, you just have to think outside the box.
Pingback: The case against homeschooling « Teacher, Revised
Am I curious about what it takes to be a public school teacher? Afraid not. I’m a homeschool parent and also a foster parent. I’ve volunteered to come sit in our foster son’s classroom, just to help, many times. I see what goes into that. In addition to that, I have 5 close family members who are teachers.
“I have questions like, How do you balance being both parent and teacher to your child?”
Easy. Child on left leg, book on right. Just kidding. As parents, we begin teaching our children from the time that they are born. Just because they turned 5 doesn’t mean that somehow we can’t keep teaching them. There’s no magic in it. In fact, I encourage my children to think in terms that LIFE is all about learning….and learning isn’t confined to our classroom.
” How do you incorporate technology into your lessons?”
Are you serious? We don’t live in a cave. Not sure what you mean, but I just got rid of 4 technological advances called “computers”. We still have 2 laptops, and I’m about to purchase another laptop for my 15 year old. They visit science museums such as Fort Discovery Center in Augusta, GA. We even have cell phones.
“How do you go about teaching a subject you know very little about?”
I have reached a limit in my teaching capacity with my oldest sons math subjects. So I hire a tutor. Or sometimes I sign my kids up for a co-op. This is like a one-day-a-week school where the kids attend with (shock!) teachers! and they get (more shock) homework. If they have problems with their subjects during the rest of the week, and it’s something I can’t help them with, they either call or email the teacher. If that still doesn’t work, we meet with them in person.
” How much homework do you give?”
None. And there’s a book written on that subject that you might be interested in called “The Case Against Homework”. You can find it in Barnes and Nobles. We work on mastery. If I do a lesson with my child, and it’s clear that my child has mastered it, what’s the point of homework? If my child has not mastered the skill, how can the be expected to do their “homework” on their own? If I help them, it’s turned into yet another school lesson. So instead we just work on it again the next day. When they’ve mastered the topic, we move on. Anyhow, by the end of the day, I’ve found that my kids brain needs a break. Incidentally, my public-schooled foster children need a mental break too, and I often feel sorry for them in the evenings when a break is no where in sight. We use several textbooks that public schools use and I’ve found that what a teacher typically would assign as “homework”, we do as classwork.
“Is it even called ‘homework’ when it’s assigned at home?”
It’s all “homework” so it really seems ridiculous to assign more.
“Do your students have to take the same standardized tests as mine?”
My kids take ITBS tests and will take the SAT and/or ACT for college purposes this year. All given by a certified tester.
” If so, how much test prep do you do each week?”
We do know preparation for the ITBS testing. The first year we took it, I explained in advance how to fill in those dots. Other than that we do nothing for the ITBS. As for the SAT, my son IS doing some prep work for that one. He wants to be able to get into some very good colleges so he is studying for this and taking some practice tests to see how he would do.
“In short, I want to know your best (and worst) practices.”
My best practice is that we adhere to a schedule. School is not an “option” nor do we “play school” at home. If my kids fail academically, I have no one to blame but myself. I do not allow my children to skip much school, even if they are sick. If they are running a fever, and I give them tylenol and they feel better…they well enough for school. As a result of my “school naziism”, my children test incredibly well on their standardized tests. We look up things CONSTANTLY, like bugs or plants to find out what kind they are. We read msnbc quite a bit and then discuss the articles, what we agreed with or disagreed with. There is always some sort of intellectual debate going on. My son believes in creationism, as opposed to evolutionism. As a result of his love for debate, he’s read many, many…many books on the topic. Then he often participates in online debates. He’s has tested in the 99% in science, and frankly, I think he can hold his own in any debate for EITHER side, lol.
What do I do wrong? Post furiously on the internet when I discover an article about “selfish homeschoolers”. . Seriously, sometimes I push the kids too hard. Sometimes I’m not as organized as I should be. There’s no difference between teacher and Mom. As a result, if the kids were to pray at dinner and say some grammatical error, then when the prayer is over I correct them, “You should have said, “had not has”.
My kids are those “geeks” that Jesse wrote about. He’s different and he knows it. He’s very comfortable with that….if other’s aren’t, well, that’s their problem.
I hope this gives you a view of what it’s like in our home.
Much to my embarrassment, after rereading what I wrote I can see a ton of grammatical errors.
Please try to ignore them…and remember, I typing this stuff either when I have 7 kids running around, or else late at night when they are in bed, and I’m so tired I can hardly form a proper mental sentence, much less write one.
As you can tell, I rarely ever proofread or edit what I write.
Dear Michelle,
I used to avoid writing. Then I started to home school, and realized I had to learn how.
My grasp of Grammar and Spelling is still pretty bad. That being said, it is improving. I improve through study, and by writing a great deal.
I recommend “Eats, Shoots and Leaves” by Lynn Truss. It’s very helpful, and not at all painful. I also recommend “The Language Mechanic” from The Critical Thinking Company. It may be that this unique approach will connect a few dots for you. If it doesn’t, never fear. It makes a good series of unit studies for 6th-7th graders.
I also recommend you write a lot. Write constantly, and use the Spelling and Grammar check functions in your word processing programs.
Last but not least, take heart! You would be amazed how badly most people write. Journalists and technical writers are the worst! Really and truly, once you start going over your own work with a fine toothed comb, “stoopid” errors will leap out at you from every page, computer screen and billboard.
Never call anyone on Spelling or Grammar, because that sword cuts both ways. Just do your best, but don’t obsess.
See, now this is a much more civil discussion. It is nice to have the question asked instead of just assuming one knows everything about said subject. Boy would the anti-homeschoolers have a heyday with me, as I am an unschooler. However, I welcome any questions and love to let people know about all the options and different methods of homeschooling. It really becomes a way of life and the ultimate goal is to teach your child HOW to learn, so that they can always do just that. Once they know they can learn anything they want to, watch out!
For what it’s worth: parents = teachers. There’s no balance needed.
What if you come to dislike or be afraid of your parent/teacher? Who do you have to turn to?
The same people anyone else would turn to – a friend, a family member, or even social services.
Again, the assumption seems to be that homeschoolers live in lockdown and the children are only allowed outside of their confinement for a few minutes a day (if they’re lucky).
In my case, my parents and I get along fine 99.9% of the time. We’re with each other more than the average public schooled kid, I think, therefore we have the time to get to know each other, respect each other, understand each other….we hardly ever fight. When I dislike something about my parents, I talk to them about it. We resolve it. It’s over. I’m never afraid of my parents.
If something truly disturbing happened, I would probably turn to a friend or another parent I know, like Erica said. My parents are certainly *not* the only adults I know.
As for who to turn to, many homeschoolers come from medium to large families. The siblings have one another and are often very close. Of course, they also have friends, neighbors, and often pastors, youth leaders, and the like.
One of the biggest challenges to homeschoolers (though not insurmountable) is the toddler. Not all of us have to deal with this and it’s not ever present for those that do, but I find the 18 month – 2 1/2 year old to be the greatest challenge to the school day. You have to be creative and proactive.
By the way, I didn’t mean to imply that when baby comes, all teaching stops. I just meant that there are natural periods in life where things are bumpier and at others they run more smoothly. But, that is life and that is precisely where homeschooling takes place – the real world.
“teacher revised” (I don’t know which TR poster) asks: What if you come to dislike or be afraid of your parent/teacher? Who do you have to turn to?
Possibilities: Neighbors, relatives, the scoutmaster, 4-h leader, music teacher, a friend’s parents, somebody in your local home-school group, Sunday school teachers, a doctor or a nurse, fellow church members, people on the local sports team, friends on the internet, social services, the local police department….
2 percent of children are homeschooled. How many children do you suppose slip through the cracks of the public school system every year? I would bet it’s more than two percent.
I would also like to point out that home-schooling children for many is an issue of equity. The idea that you can stay home with your children is accessible to a small percentage of individuals.
-
Firstly: Is it necessary to mention that there are some people who have no legs when discussing the benefits of walking or jogging as an exercise? Does it further a discussion involved in comparing and contrasting two types of vehicles to say, “well, some people are blind or have epilepsy and can’t drive at all?”
And secondly- sure, there are some people who cannot homeschool, but having homeschooled my large family since 1988, including living on an enlisted man’s salary for most of those years, I know it’s not really only accessible to a ‘small percentage’ of individuals due to finances. It’s actually only denied to a small percentage of individuals due to finances.
I have known single moms who homeschooled their children. I know one single mom with 10 kids (most of them adopted) who homeschools her children- it’s not easy, but it’s important to her. I know a single dad who homeschools his children. And I know plenty of homeschoolers living at or below the poverty line who are still homeschooling their children.
We have lived on one enlisted man’s income, have been often eligible for food stamps and WIC (we passed on the food stamps, but I know we were eligible because other families with my husband’s rank and fewer kids than we got food stamps), sometimes with no vehicle, mostly with only one, clothed our children from thrift shops, bought their Christmas and birthday presents at thrift shops and yard sales, and eaten a fairly substantial supply of beans and rice to make it possible to do what we’re doing. I have washed cloth diapers in a bathtub to make this possible. We did not go out to the movies for well over a decade to make this possible. We have gone through midwestern summers with no air conditioning to make this possible. We lived in a rented house in Washington in a neighborhood where we heard shots fired from time to time, and where the cops were frequently called- I foiled a car robbery in progress while up with a sick child one night- and we lived there because it was where we could afford to live.
I have worked very hard to make that enlisted man’s salary stretch to feed, clothe, and house us all so that we could homeschool the children because it mattered immensely to us that we do this. Please do not denigrate that hard work and sacrifice that so many homeschoolers make by implying it was something easily affordable and only available to us as an issue of ‘equity.’
And for those few who genuinely might want to homeschool but could not afford to homeschool, they often live in the poorest school districts where their children’s education suffers greatly. I would rather see us have a system like the GI bill for children, where the funds follow the children and the children and parents choose where and how the children are educated- home, private, or other public schools than those in their district.
DeputyHeadmistress,
There are many other factors that would make homeschooling difficult or impossible besides income. The fact is it is absolutely not an option for many children in America. That doesn’t mean that it shouldn’t be an option for those privileged and dedicated enough to do it—just that it should be acknowledged that not everyone has access to it. And, yes, I think that kind of acknowledgment is necessary.
Alistair
Alistair,
There are a lot of privileges in life that are only available to those who fight with dogged determination to realize their goals.
There are very, very few families for whom homeschooling is not an option. Most people defend their life choices with false imperatives, and avoid accepting responsibility for the consequences of their choices by telling themselves “Life’s so unfair. I can never get a break.”
All my life so called “underprivileged” children and adults have made me, my family and my friends the target of their anger. People whose food stamps and WIC meant their food budgets were double ours, people who had televisions, cars and enough loose change to fund their crack habits, viewed us with anger and envy. They’ve reviled us, they’ve spat on us, they’ve assaulted us, they’ve stolen from us (yes, literally) and they’ve felt justified in doing so. All they wanted us to do is abandon hope, and begin to hate. Thank God it didn’t happen.
I know handicapped single parents with non-academic high school certificates of attendance who home school.
Where there’s a will, there’s a way. Where there’s no will, there’s anger and resentment directed at those who, through their mere existence, demonstrate that where there is a will, there is a way.
When I think of all the vitriol that’s been directed at me for daring to try, I feel a sad. You call trying harder a privilege. You want me to see trying harder as a privilege too. I will never agree. I see trying harder as a responsibility. People who accept responsibilities do enjoy privileges, but not in the way resentful, angry people imagine. You ask me to acknowledge that “it (homeschooling) is absolutely not an option for many children in America.”
You’re right. Love is absolutely not an option for many children in America. Trust is absolutely not an option for many children in America. A bath, clean clothes and safe shelter are not options for many children in America. Good educations are not an option for many children in America. Competent, ethical mentors are not an option for many children in America.
Must I go on?
It is wrong to deny children these things. In virtually every case, children who are denied these things are under-privileged because they were born to adults who dodge their responsibilities.
I will not start making bad choices, simply so that my children will not have any so called “privileges” in life. What you apparently consider privileges, I consider to be the minimum standard.
It would be very, very good if our local public school was willing and able to meet reasonable minimum standards of education. (A lot of tax dollars are tossed into those money pits.) Until it does, we’ll home school. You may call it a privilege, the angry, self-pitying people who choose not to home school may call it a privilege, but we’ll continue to call it our parental responsibility.
Each child deserves a decent education. If my children get decent educations, they will be empowered to make a positive difference in the world. Their lives will have a positive impact on their community, and those who didn’t get decent educations will benefit as well. Denying my children a decent education does not benefit other children who are similarly denied.
Pretending home schooling is a “privilege” available only to an unfairly advantaged few keeps loving parents who might otherwise give it a try mired in self-pity.
No!
You misunderstand much of my argument. Of course I’m not suggesting that you should make bad choices so that your children don’t receive so-called privileges. If homeschooling is right for your child, and you possess the means to do it, you should homeschool by all means. And I commend your sacrifice and hard work. But to not admit to your privileged situation seems dishonest (or at the very best, lacking in perspective). Look—the word ‘privileged’ carries a lot of connotations. I don’t mean it as a negative (or that it’s unfair necessarily), just as a fact of life.
And I still contend there are many students to whom homeschooling is not an option. If you read Jill’s post (from today, June 8th), you will understand what I mean. Her students’ parents are not self-pitying. They are simply not there, or not capable of homeschooling (due to lack of education, addiction, poverty, etc.). This is not an anomoly—it is the reality in most urban schools.
I would also point out that parents can make the decision to put their children in public schools without being ‘irresponsible’ parents.
Again—this doesn’t mean you shouldn’t homeschool your children, just that it’s not fair to conclude that everyone has access to such a choice. They simply don’t.
“You misunderstand much of my argument. ”
Nope. I disagree with you.
More to the point, I RESPECTFULLY disagree with you. Note that I do not assume that you and I have a difference of opinion because you do not understand my argument. I’m willing to consider the possibility that you do understand my points, and still disagree.
To imply that we would agree, if only you understood my argument, would be vain to the point of lunacy.
It would be pointless to attempt a reasoned discussion with a person suffering from such delusions.
The misunderstanding I was referring to was when you suggested that I was urging you to make bad choices. Again, I think we do agree on the most important point—you should have the freedom to homeschool your child and you shouldn’t be derided for that choice. What we disagree on is the question of access.
Thanks for the lively discussion!
I agree that there are *some* children who are not in places where the adults who are responsible for them can or are willing to homeschool. I just disagree that it’s quite as many as you think it is. I know this is true because we have often fallen in the socio-economic category that supposedly cannot afford to live on income. I know this because I know parents from all races and classes who actively homeschool. I know this because I know people homeschooling (and homeschooling well) who do not have high school diplomas. I know this because I have known many single parents who homeschool their children (and studies show no statistical difference between these children children homeschooled by college grads- that difference only shows up when children attend public school, indicating it is educationally dangerous for high school drop outs to send their children to public school.=)
It is not privilege. It is grit and determination. Neither is it because of ‘privilege’ that parents choose not to use drugs or drink themselves into a stupor. It was not ‘privilege’ that helped my husband overcome his own background of a long history of alcoholic, high school drop out, multiply married adults (not all his siblings or cousins did overcome).
Public schools graduate approximately 1/4 of their students with diplomas who remain illiterate. This does not count the kids who drop out because they cannot read. Illiterates who graduate from their homeschools are a number that so far has proven to be statistically immeasurable.
I also am not convinced that public school is doing what it should for those children who for whatever reason cannot be homeschooled- and I married one of those children all grown up. He feels deeply defrauded by his public school education, as well he should.
And… I would still like to know if those students only got to hear one side when it comes to military recruitment policies, or, in the interest of exposing them to various opinions and many sides of an issue rather than the group think of the ‘progressive’ Michael Moore club, were the students allowed to hear from recruiters themselves or anybody from outside the progressive mainstream?
Thanx Deputy Headmistress.
I feel like there’s only so many ways to say the same thing…
over and over and over again.
You found one more way. Much obliged.
Blessings,
Elizabeth
This is where language is a tricky thing. I looked up the definition of “privilege” at dictionary.com (http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/privilege)
One definition: a right, immunity, or benefit enjoyed only by a person beyond the advantages of most: example – the privileges of the very rich.
I think there are a vast number of examples to show that homeschooling does not fit this definition.
Another definition: any of the rights common to all citizens under a modern constitutional government: example – We enjoy the privileges of a free people.
Under this definition, homeschooling IS a privilege in that it is legal in all 50 states. Anyone is free to participate.
Yet none of the definitions of “privilege” describe the way it is being used by teacherrevised – something that some people have the ability to do, but other people do not, for any number of reasons. If that is a definition of privilege, then EVERYTHING can be considered a privilege depending on the context, which in my opinion renders the word meaningless. But it sure makes you sound sympathetic to the “unprivileged.”
NOTE: I didn’t note the other listed meanings of privilege because they weren’t pertinent to the discussion.
Thank-U, Than-Q & Thanx, Shevrae.
I’ve never been happier to be shown up. You explained that masterfully.
I don’t think that privilege is so much about ability as it is about access (at least in the context that I’m using it). If you’re accepted to Harvard because you worked really hard, then you got there through grit and determination. If you got accepted because your aunt is the dean of admissions, that’s privilege. If you got accepted during segregation before Harvard was accepting people of color (and your scores/grades were lower than many students of color), that’s privilege. Privilege, in this context, is unearned, a birthright. The most egregious forms of privilege are those based on racism, sexism, and classism. And it doesn’t have to be as obvious as the above examples. It’s usually much more subtle and insidious. A child raised in a lower socioeconomic community where the local schools lack money and resources, who is surrounded by the negative pressures of the street, who doesn’t know anyone who has been to college, is statistically much less likely to go to college than a a child born into a middle or upper class community. That’s privilege. I think all of that fits within your first definition of privilege (especially the benefits part).
The other more important point I want to make is I am in no way advocating for sympathy for the underprivileged. I think it’s possible to understand the nature of oppression without feeling sympathy for the oppressed. Empathy, yes, but not sympathy. We must understand our collective demons before we can dispel them (or revolt against them, or subvert them). I say we because even if we fall on the privileged side of the equation (as I do), it is our duty to fight injustice and unfairness. I would also urge that to ignore the ways in which privilege has shaped our world is extremely dangerous.
As for the argument that more of my students have access to homeschooling than I am willing to admit—we will have to agree to disagree on that.
Alistair
Certainly government-sanctioned discrimination would qualify as privilege – it’s actually addressed more specifically under one of the definitions on which I chose not comment (see my note.)
I was referring specifically to your insistence that homeschooling is a privilege under the first definition. This is where I think we’re talking past each other. “Privilege” implies special treatment – or a birthright, in your words. Every homeschooler I know would tell you there’s nothing particularly special about them, just the desire and determination to do what they think is best for their children and their families. We are honored to be able to take on the responsibility and we are passionate about doing the best job we can, but that doesn’t make us privileged unless you are referring to the other definition – any of the rights common to all citizens under a modern constitutional government. But it didn’t seem you were using it in that context.
As far as access goes in practical terms, I think in general it’s a moot point. Many people don’t even have homeschooling on their radar screens and plenty of people who have heard of it aren’t even interested. My best friend is a public school teacher and hands down the best teacher I know. She’s not the least bit interested in homeschooling. It’s not a lack of access or privilege – it’s a lack of desire.
And believe it or not, most homeschoolers are just fine with that. There’s nothing wrong with it. We’re marching to the beat of our own drummer and usually pretty happy to go our own way. But we get irritated when people make stereotypical judgments about how much money we must make or what kind of strange people we must be – just like any other group of people gets irritated about being pigeon-holed.
And I would just like to point out that I was able to overcome my under-privileged status as “a child raised in a lower socioeconomic community where the local schools lack money and resources, who is surrounded by the negative pressures of the street, who doesn’t know anyone who has been to college” by working my butt off and going to college. But growing up in a rural area, my streets were more like dirt roads. As a reward for my poor status, I got through on mostly grants.
My husband is as middle-class as they come, and he’s still paying back his student loans. So I guess if you can get yourself to college, you have a chance of reversing who’s privileged.
Thanks for your thoughtful response, Shevrae. I think we agree on a lot of these points. I still think some homeschoolers would benefit from examining the ways in which their situation might be a privileged one (under the first definition). But I concede that not all homeschoolers are rich (or even middle class), and that a good many simply work really hard to provide their children with the kind of individualized education that is hard to replicate in a class of 30.
There are military recruiters on our campus every week. There will be a giant Army sign in the gym next year that will help pay for our athletic department. There are ads on TV and at the movies. There is no shortage of voices from outside the ‘progressive mainstream.’
Sigh…. Oh, the typos. Chagrin and blushes.
I know this is true because we have often fallen in the socio-economic category that supposedly cannot afford to live on income.
‘to live on ONLY ONE income.’
(and studies show no statistical difference between these children children homeschooled by college grads- that difference only shows up when children attend public school
Studies show no significant statistical difference between children homeschooled by parents with NO high school diploma and those homeschooled by college grads- that difference only shows up when children attend public school…
As a point of interest, the gaps between minorities and whites also disappear when children are homeschooled. That doesn’t happen so much with the gaps between girls and boys in maths and English. I do realize that it appears to teachers this is because homeschoolers self-select for involved parents, and there may be something to that. However, the studies also show that the *longer* a child had been homeschooled, the more those typical gaps (black/white; college educated/high school diploma/drop-out parents) disappear.
And many of us who have had children in public school can testify about just how hard it is to be involved at a significant level. I had one child in public school one year, and adopted another child who had been in public school several years and had multiple disabilities. I found my efforts to be involved as anything more than a gopher were stymied at every step- involvement was not what was wanted. Obedience was what was required, with a little bit of fawning admiration for good measure.
Elizabeth Conley- I really like what you write. Do you have a blog?
TeacherRevised- it isn’t that I do not recognize that some children are failed at home- I could hardly fail to recognize that given my husband’s background. I have tutored the child of a neighbor being failed by his school and home, and we often keep two little boys for weekends who are poster children for the sort of under-privileged background you’re talking about.
It isn’t that I don’t appreciate that there are wonderful teachers out there who are striving valiantly to make a difference.
I just think the system is far more flawed than you realize, and true reform is not going to happen within the confines and conformity of the fish tank of public education as we know it. The best fix I can think of is to dismantle the bureaucracy altogether and have the parents direct where the education dollars go- compete for those dollars with home-schools, private schools, charter schools, correspondence schools. More real education, less testing that requires teaching to a test, which requires that your curriculum is actually set for you by faceless test writers.
And, with others, I would add some pleading that you read John Taylor Gatto, John Holt, and, I would add, Richard Mitchell (Graves of Academe; Leaning Tower of Babel; The Underground Grammarian).
Nope, no blog. I majored in Mathematics to avoid learning Grammar and Spelling. Home schooling has largely blown that plan out of the water, but I’m still not confident in those areas.
If I had a blog I’d spend my days hunched over the computer, cursing.
Every time I review something I’ve written, I find “just one more” error. It doesn’t matter if it’s the first review, or the forty first. I drive myself stark, staring nuts looking for that last typo. Since I’m appallingly fluent in “colorful metaphor”, the resultant expansion of the kids’ vocabularies would be unfortunate.
How ’bout you? Are you a blogger?
Alistair (?), thanks so much for answering my question. I do appreciate it. But having military recruiters doing their job on campus isn’t exactly what I was asking. I should have been more clear. You have told us your students were listening to a guest speaker who came to discuss classist and racist policies that guide military recruitment.
That wording sounds like you and the speaker believe it is a given that it is racist and military policies that guide military recruitment. Did you give equal time in the classroom to somebody who disagrees with this point of view?
Having recruiters allowed on campus is hardly the same thing (it’s simply required by law) and the fact that students might see a sign in your gym, see ads on television, and see a recruiter on campus is not remotely the same thing as presenting an opposing viewpoint in the classroom. After all, the ads don’t talk about the same issue, nor do the recruiters waste their time discussing recruitment policies.
Instead, what I am hearing is that you used the classroom as a place to present only point of view and did not make a two-sided presentation on the issues available to your students.
This would be like me hosting a guest in my homeschool to explain to my students all the reasons to be opposed to public schools- according to the line of reasoning you have offered, this would be fair and in no way biased, because after all, my children see public schooled students, and they see public schools promoted in various forms of media, and the school bus picks kids up just up the street from us.
This would be like hosting a Republican speaker to explain what’s wrong with the Democrats and not having a Democrat there to answer the accusation, because, after all, there are Democrats on campus and students see them all the time and see advertisements for the Democrat party.
This is precisely the sort of thing that people are talking about when they explain that public schools are places that promote conformity and do not welcome diverse viewpoints.
We have a military recruiter debate the counter-recruiter.
Glad to see this conversation has calmed down (as have I). My thoughts on being “privileged” to homeschool:
1. Homeschooling is a lot more egalitarian than other alternative education options, as it is possible to do it at little to no cost;
2. Homeschooling is, in some ways, more egalitarian than public schooling, because children don’t have to meet test standards as either “gifted” or “learning disabled” to have a personalized learning situation created for them;
3. Homeschooling is an option, not a privilege: parents have always had the right to direct their children’s education (as the courts have found).
4. As others have said, homeschooling doesn’t *feel* like a privilege (in the way that going to prep school would, I imagine); for many of us it requires choosing to live a “simpler” lifestyle without many of the things other families provide for their kids.
5. For the at-home parent it can also mean a re-ordering of priorities that cuts back on career and self-fulfillment or puts them on hold for a time — I hesitate to say “sacrifice,” but definitely not a bonus of homeschooling.
Obviously traditional, brick-and-mortar public school, in theory if not always in reality, serves a need in society. Alternatives (which include public charter schools and magnet schools, “Free Schools” in inner city neighborhoods and other private schools of all stripes, tutoring, correspondence schools, independent learning and public-school-at-home programs) serve an important need as well.
The fact that these alternatives are not available to everyone is not the fault of the people who are providing them. It puzzles me why you consider educational “equity” an issue that homeschoolers themselves should address. It should be an issue for society at large to deal with.
I would also urge that to ignore the ways in which privilege has shaped our world is extremely dangerous.
And I would argue that nobody has done that here, and it is just as dangerous to attribute too much to privilege as too little.
As for the argument that more of my students have access to homeschooling than I am willing to admit—we will have to agree to disagree on that.
I do not think I was so arrogant as to tell you anything about your specific students, whom you know and I do not. I thought we were speaking in general terms in response to what gehry said:
I would also like to point out that home-schooling children for many is an issue of equity. The idea that you can stay home with your children is accessible to a small percentage of individuals.
Nothing there about your specific students. It was a much broader generalization applies to the population at large, and I have seen no evidence that it is true that ‘the idea that you can stay home with your children’ is one of privilege, equity, or accessible only to a small percentage of individuals.
It is available to more than a small percentage regardless of ‘privilege’ or ‘equity,’ the majority simply prefer not to choose that route, and that’s fine.
Thanks, btw, for answering my question more specifically (about the military recruiting). It is puzzling to me that you would have phrased your initial statement as you did (they heard a guest speaker explain the racist and classist policies of military recruitment so schools are not teaching conformity) if it was actually a debate with two sides presented and a military recruiter presenting the military’s side. And it also seems odd to me that when I ask if they ever hear the other side, you tell me about how the recruiters have ads on television and visit the campus regularly rather than clarifying for me that instead of only one guest speaker (singular usage in your first statement) there were actually two guest speakers presenting both sides, But okay. Glad that’s cleared up.
“a child raised in a lower socioeconomic community where the local schools lack money and resources, who is surrounded by the negative pressures of the street, who doesn’t know anyone who has been to college”
You just described my husband, who did hard drugs as a teen, sold drugs (exchanged a grade in his class for drugs for his teacher), and got his college degree when he was nearly forty years old. No other member of his large and rather messy family has gone to college. A majority of them do not have a high school diploma. The summer before we dated he lived in a tent with a bunch of other guys and did construction. So yes, I realize it requires a certain freedom of thought to go another route than the default position of the world around you- but it can be done, often is done, and when it isn’t done it is usually (not always, just often) the result of bad personal *choices.*
You explained earlier to me that your students knew enough about what military recruiters do and why because they saw ads on television and saw recruiters at school. The kids in school actually do know people who have gone to college. They see them every day for 8 hours or so, five days a week, nine months out of the year. And they see ads for college on television, the internet, and the radio. They hear college being pushed by the President and in television programs.
I am not saying it’s easy or even that ‘everybody’ could do it. But more could than do. And you don’t need a college degree to teach your own children. You need to be literate and have access to a library. The literacy requirement, I’ll grant you, would be difficult to overcome. But then, the children of illiterate adults don’t do very well in public schools, either.
I read Jill Guerra’s 21 notes of farewell today- a beautiful post. And what I noticed about them is that she is telling her students they can make choices and do things that you are telling us are impossible.
She tells them things like:
study and work hard and you will be able to be a great art teacher…
I want to hear about the wonderful things you will do in college…
I would love to see you do something to help make a better world (such as being a CHEF that brings Fair Trade food to all communities!). You are a leader…
You have the power to make your life the way you want it to be. …
You are in control of your own life and you can do ANYTHING you set your mind to….
Whether you decide to work to help the homeless or you become a healthy food chef (or a teacher), I know that you will be your best…
You are ready for any challenge, including college…
Is she lying to them? Just giving a meaningless, empty pep talk that she doesn’t believe? Or are these things true? And if they are true for these children, could they not have been true for their parents at some point?
Homeschooling is an option, not a privilege as a previous poster said. Being responsible for your child’s education is neither an option nor a privilege- it’s every parents’ responsibility, regardless of which educational option they choose.
I said my students. I meant urban students. Ask any teacher in Oakland if homeschooling is an option for their students.
Honestly, I don’t think I have an obligation to invite a military recruiter into the classroom along with the counter-recruiter. In some cases we do organize the debate, but not always. The military recruits more heavily in schools where there are a lot of poor kids (which often means kids of color). This just makes good business sense from the military’s perspective. Why would you spend your time and money fishing in one river when you know you’ll catch more fish in another? Poor kids need college money and the military says they’ll give it to them. What they don’t say is that less than %50 of recruits will actually see that money. My students are on the receiving end of so much pro-military propaganda, I don’t think I need to give lip service to the Army, even in the name of objectivity. Criticize me if you want. I don’t want my students going to war to chase a paycheck there’s a good chance they won’t receive anyway. Now, if they know the realities, and they still choose to go, I support their decision. I just want their decision to be an informed one.
They don’t have parents, brothers, sisters, friends who have gone to college. That’s where the statistics that I was talking about come into play. I don’t know the specific numbers but students whose parents went to college for just one day are dramatically more likely to go to college themselves (have I already written this? I don’t remember).
And as for your last point, I’m trying hard not to be offended by it. My official job title is English teacher. But my real job is convincing my students they can do anything they want to do if they work hard enough, just like Jill tells her students. I have no idea where you got the idea I was telling you that was impossible. Many of my students face some bleak realities, but nothing is impossible. And, yes, of course, that was true for their parents too. Where you and I differ on this (I think) is that you believe it is through some fault of the parents that they didn’t transcend their surroundings and make a better life for themselves and their children. While I would never go so far as to suggest the parents are blameless (I believe in personal accountability as much as you do), I also want to understand the societal ills that keep people (particularly oppressed communities) from realizing their potential as learners, thinkers, scholars, etc.
Military recruiters do profile: but the main characteristic they profile for is physical fitness. My brother (athletic and involved in HS sports) was hounded during his junior and senior years, and the calls didn’t stop coming even after he went off to college. My family wasn’t poor by any stretch of the imagination. I live in one of the richest counties in my state; by your logic, there shouldn’t even be a recruiting office here.
Last point first- I am utterly taken aback that you are offended by my last paragraph. I don’t know what to say to that. No offense at all was intended, no hostility, no rudeness. I liked Jill’s post- it was one of hope and optimism and belief in the ability of the human spirit to overcome adversity. I believe that, too, but I can’t tell that you do. You say you do. But then you tell us all the reasons why it isn’t true and homeschooling is only possible because of privilege. Your last paragraph seems a confusing mass of contradictions to me but I am a linear thinker and perhaps that is why.
I meant urban students. Ask any teacher in Oakland if homeschooling is an option for their students.
That is certainly a sweeping generalization. As it happens, we have friends in Oakland. They homeschool their large family on a pastor’s salary. They are members of a homeschool support group in Oakland. So it clearly an option for some students in Oakland.
Honestly, I don’t think I have an obligation to invite a military recruiter into the classroom along with the counter-recruiter. In some cases we do organize the debate, but not always.
So then it was a one-sided presentation after all? Or often times it is? I am very confused, and I keep trying to get an answer on this because I think it matters- and I am either being exceptionally obtuse (quite possible), or there is a reason it is so hard to get a clear answer on this- which would also be a point I think matters.
The military recruits more heavily in schools where there are a lot of poor kids (which often means kids of color). This just makes good business sense from the military’s perspective. Why would you spend your time and money fishing in one river when you know you’ll catch more fish in another?
You do realize you just explained why recruitment practices are driven by pragmatic rather than racist or classist policies? Another factor recruiters consider when deciding which school they will spend more time in is how well those students will do on the ASVAB. They won’t spend much time in schools where the students typically do poorly on the ASVAB- which means not so much the alternative schools, which are also lower income and often students of color. They won’t spend much time, if any, with kids who don’t have a diploma- oh, which would also mean a group where a greater percentage are disadvantaged or kids of color.
I am very concerned that your feelings about the military are so strong that the specific topic (the military) here is distracting from the issue I am trying to clarify. It doesn’t matter what the topic is, I think the principle is the same.
You don’t have to be pro-military or giving lip service to the Army- I think it is problematic to present the class with a dogmatic presentation of only one side’s view of the underlying *motivations* of the other side, whether the issue is homeschooling, the military, abortion, saying the Pledge (we don’t, by the way), or whatever.
Regardless of what you think of the military, what you are describing not only *can be* interpreted as being motivated by what’s efficient and effective, rather than racism or classism, that actually is how you described it to me, but for some reason (if I am following you correctly), not to your students.
Poor kids need college money and the military says they’ll give it to them. What they don’t say is that less than %50 of recruits will actually see that money.
Um… Okay. I don’t know if that’s true or not, but if it is, it might because less that half of recruits choose to follow up and go to college. Or because it doesn’t matter if their college funds are available if they can’t get a good enough score on the SAT to get into any college. Or because they aren’t equipped to deal with college, and the military expects to be reimbursed for failed classes. Or maybe some other reason. And it seems to me to be a separate issue- and a good one to pass on to your students, something that could be objectively proven (although the ‘why’ less subject to proof)- but I am not sure what this has to do with having a guest speaker come to your class to tell them that military recruitment policies are driven by racist and classist policies without having somebody else there to present another interpretation and allowing the students to make their own fully informed assessment of the data based on full access to information from both points of view.
My students are on the receiving end of so much pro-military propaganda, I don’t think I need to give lip service to the Army, even in the name of objectivity. Criticize me if you want.
So…. it was a one-side presentation after all?
Leaving aside the ‘propaganda’ claim, it appears from what you now say that my first guess- that this was a one-sided presentation, was correct. And I am not asking you to give lip service to the Army. You are ascribing specific *motivations* to military recruitment practices, and whether your assessment of those motivations are correct or not is subject to debate, but you’re only facilitating one side of that debate and not making available to your students the information that there are other quite valid ways of interpreting the data- and you call that informed, and I don’t. And if it were some other topic you aren’t so invested in emotionally, I really think you’d agree with me. But that’s kind of the issue- there are lots of issues teachers are invested in emotionally, and they tend to be the same, and they are viewed as experts and objective at that, and given a platform from which to instill those views in children- and their own objectivity is, well, questionable. It’s human to be less than objective about topics you are passionate about.
Your passion, I think, is causing you to miss less conspiratory and nasty explanations for how recruiting works,. It appears to me that you are confusing correlation with causation, and this is important.
I don’t want my students going to war to chase a paycheck there’s a good chance they won’t receive anyway. Now, if they know the realities, and they still choose to go, I
support their decision. I just want their decision to be an informed one.
For you, I think this is about your opinion of the military, and hence your reluctance to be plain speaking about whether or not the guest speaker’s dogmatic statements were allowed to be countered. For me, the issue of the military is a distant third.
Telling your students that it’s a fact that military recruitment policies are motivated by racism and classism without permitting somebody else equal time to point out other possible reasons they spend more time at an average school than a prep school does not make for better informed students, if by informed we mean students who have a well rounded understanding of the issues around a topic.
If I am right and you only had the one side presented in the class, then you have allowed your politics to influence the classroom, and you don’t even seem to realize it. And this is what people are talking about when they talk about how public schools promote a uniformity of thought and conformity.
That’s the first issue for me- and it wouldn’t change if the subject of the guest speaker was something other than the military, even if it was something with which I agreed (say, a representative from The National Right to Life organization).
There is a second issue which only arose after you offered me (what *appear* to me to be) varying explanations of the guest speaker. I am trying to ascertain if I am being dense or you are being unnecessarily cagey and coy about giving me an honest and straightforward answer.
If I am being dense and not following a straightforward account, I shall apologize and soak my head. If the reason the various statements you’ve made about this guest speaker seem contradictory to me is because they ARE contradictory, I shall be deeply disappointed, and I am not sure there is anything left to say.
Deputy Headmistress,
As a U.S. Marine Corps veteran who went to school on the G.I. Bill, I think I have a few insights to offer here.
The form of the G.I. Bill has changed many times over. I participated in a capped 2 for 1 program back in the early 80s. (Yep, I’m old Corps. I learned to type on a Remington manual field typewriter. My grizzled old company Gunny was rumored to have qualified on the range with Jesus Christ.)For every dollar I put in, the government put in 2. The cap was 8100.
No, that wasn’t one of my infamous typos. The cap was 8100 dollars. That was my college fund. My husband maxed his out too. That was what we went to college on. OK – That, and beans, rice and chicken franks, plus cans of surplus freeze-dried vegetable tabs. Those things would stretch forever.
The money wasn’t squat. What the Marine Corps gave us to go to college on was grit. Spending a few years in the Marines before going to college is like swallowing a live bullfrog for breakfast. It’s nutritious, and nothing else that comes your way later in the day fazes you much.
The U.S. Armed Forces are the least racist institution in the country. It’s one of the best places in the world to learn that achievement is not about where you’re from, or what color you are; it’s about your choices and your follow through. It’s where you learn when and how to conform, and when and how to express your individuality.
Military service clarifies values and hones perception. A veteran can get through a Sociology 101 class taught by a pedantic ideologue, BS his/her way to an A, and afterward write the Professor a scathing evaluation describing him/her as a egomaniacal loon.
This is possible because the Marine understands that the objective is to pass the class, and participant opinions belong in after-action reports.
A less confident, less resilient student would either adopt the professor’s nutty ideology, or argue his/her way into a C-.
If the recruiter makes anyone uncomfortable, then that individual would be wise to be forthright and gracious about it. It’s best to look the recruiter dead in the eye and discuss any concerns. The recruiter is not the kind of person sheltered civilians imagine him/her to be. S/He’s a rational, self-actualizing adult with a solid education from the school of hard knocks. It can be the beginning of a very worthwhile dialog.
Poor kids need college money and the military says they’ll give it to them. What they don’t say is that less than %50 of recruits will actually see that money.
I just wanted to add my two cents on this. I don’t know all the reasons why this happens (as DH stated as well) but I do know one. A friend of mine came from a single-parent low-income background and she joined the Air Force. During her time there she was trained as a radiation technician and now she has a well-paying job in a hospital. Her training was enough – she didn’t need a college degree. So she didn’t apply for college money and didn’t use any, but it’s not for any shady reason on the part of the military.
This is it for me and I’m out. I think your analysis that I don’t believe in “the ability for the human spirit to overcome adversity” (and the paragraph that offended me in the previous comment) are both unfair. If that were true, I would not teach where I teach. My job is to help students overcome adversity. I do it every day. Where did I ever write that wasn’t possible? You have accused me of many things in your comments, and I believe perverted what was a respectful discussion (during which I have conceded points on at least two occasions).
Okay. There are some families in Oakland who homeschool. I’m glad because I truly believe homeschool is a wonderful and life-saving option for some kids. Many of my own students would benefit from it.
You’re right. I don’t think there is more to say.
@TeacherRevised (Alistair?) – This discussion is veering off into all sorts of other areas. You teach kids from poor families. We get it.
Why is it more our responsibility as homeschoolers than of society at large?
Why do you assume we need telling more than families who send their kids to rich suburban school districts or expensive urban private schools?
Homeschooling — which in my state is completely unfunded by the government — does not take anything away from public school students. In some cases, homeschoolers are helping: I know one family who started a math enrichment program in a nearby inner-city school, and I’m sure there are many similar stories out there.
It seems like you resent homeschooling parents for not sending their kids to public schools, as if that would make them better. Why not say all top college graduates must become teachers in inner city schools instead of pursuing more attractive careers? That would do a lot more to help the schools than forcing homeschoolers (back) into the system.
Beautifully stated blog post! To answer your questions:
How do you balance being both parent and teacher to your child?
This is the toughest part of homeschooling. What my husband and I have done is to set up specific roles for each of us. I won’t lie and say that there are never any power struggles during school time here, however, they are very few and far between since we instituted specific roles and made sure our child understood them clearly.
Another good question to ask along these same lines would have been: How do you help to prevent your child from thinking the universe is child centered, that his parents exist primarily to meet his needs?
I feel it is very important for homeschooling parents (especially mothers) to have rich and full lives away from their children. This can include education, work, and friendships that have nothing to do with the kids. I also feel it is imperative that children have a wide variety of responsibilities, not only for their schoolwork, but for self care. I think a lot of parents take for granted all the things children are responsible for in a school setting when mom isn’t around to do it for them.
How do you incorporate technology into your lessons?
My child does take some online courses, but I don’t really consider those “incorporating technology” very much. Multimedia content is a great thing to use to supplement lessons, but I feel we make the best use of technology by use of practical applications. My dd might make a Powerpoint presentation to go with a report, or chart experiment results from a lab on a spreadsheet, for example.
How do you go about teaching a subject you know very little about?
I don’t really do much teaching of anything. I try to be more of a learning facilitator rather than a teacher in the traditional sense. I look at the course, plan it out, and determine exactly what resources I am going to need to help my child succeed in that course- books, tutors, online classes, videos, etc. We are also lucky to live in an area surrounded by colleges and universities, and have access to a lot of graduate students and professors that have been instrumental in helping our child understand difficult concepts and showing her how the information she is learning can be applied to real-world situations.
How much homework do you give? Is it even called ‘homework’ when it’s assigned at home?
Lol- yes, we call it homework. Generally, my daughter spends about 5 hours or so a day completing her lessons. Anything that doesn’t get finished is homework. In addition to that, she also has reading or vocabulary study, and sometimes needs to study for a test the next day. Homework can vary between 30 minutes to 2 hours.
Do your students have to take the same standardized tests as mine? If so, how much test prep do you do each week?
No, my child doesn’t take the same standardized tests as yours. We have her evaluated individually by a psychologist on instruments such as the Woodcock Johnson and the WIAT. Next year, we are considering using the MAPS test. We do not do any test prep whatsoever. We want the tests to be a true reflection of her ability. My daughter will also be taking the EXPLORE through Johns Hopkins Center for Talented Youth.
As for understanding the life of a public school teacher, I have many public school teacher friends for whom I am very grateful. Many of them have and continue to play an instrumental role in helping us on our homeschooling journey. As you said, we’re all teachers here and we’re all in this together. Thanks to you for such a great post.
(As you’ve pointed out, home school parents are risk takers. We gamble. You’re right about this. What you fail to grasp are the stakes, and the care with which we weigh the odds.)
Public schools gamble with other people’s children. New Math, Whole Language, dumping phonics (and then discovering four years later that the kids aren’t learning to read anymore), values clarification, situation ethics- there have been far too many failed educational fads come and go in public schools for that to have been a reasonable criticism of homeschools.
Good grief, I cannot believe this debate. People get to do what’s right for them. I know some absolutely fabulous homeschooling parents. I know some fabulous teachers. I know many bad teachers, those who are just phoning it in. I know homeschooling parents who have done the job for several years, then decided to opt for public school in high school. What works for one family might not work for another. But all the resources are out there to help parents be successful teachers! Teachers have to spend so much of their time on housekeeping, and discipline, that much time is lost, in my own opinion. Parents can go online and find just about everything they need, from teaching reading and math, to creating a nurturing classroom environment. “Wolf Pack Classroom Management” is great for that, for the younger children — it’s good for traditional teachers and homeschooling parents alike. It’s concise, easy to implement and fun for teachers/parents and students.
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The other home school moms have covered the questions well. I’ll just add a comment or two.
You ask, “How do you go about teaching a subject you know very little about?” I would like to ask you the same question. How do public school teachers do this?
As a public middle school teacher (who now home schools), I was forced to teach a subject for five years that I was not certified to teach. This has been a common practice in public schools. I stayed a step ahead of my students by reading the material and researching ahead of time.
I would like to challenge all teachers (whether public or home school) to become informed about what’s happening in the public schools. As a public school teacher I was clueless about the fact that the new assessments (formerly called achievement tests) assess children’s attitudes, beliefs and values. B. K. Eakman explains this frightening trend and many others in her books Educating for the New World Order, Cloning of the American Mind, and Walking Targets. (These can be purchased on Amazon.)
In Cloning of the American Mind, Eakman explains how home schools are/may be affected by various education reforms. This is not the time for home school parents to stick our heads in the sand when it comes to state and federal reforms. We need to stay well informed and prayed up (for those of us who pray)!
I just published an article on my blog about testing that explains some of the problems with modern assessments taken by public, private, and home school children. The title is “Testing, Testing, Testing: What Christian Parents Need to Know about the Assessments Their Children Take.”
God Bless,
Deborah Douglass
What you wrote is great advice any way that you look at it.
This is really a good example
thx
How do you balance being both parent and teacher to your child?
From the moment my children were born I have been both a parent and a teacher. When we are actually doing schoolwork, I am still a parent, but one who will help them with their work and read to and with them. If discipline action is ever necessary, it is handled the way many schoolteachers would – time out, writing sentences several times, etc. This doesn’t happen too often, though. When we are not having school, we are constantly learning new things, both my children and myself. If they ask me a question, I answer. If I don’t know the answer I find out the answer.
How do you incorporate technology into your lessons?
My 2nd and 4th grade children already know how to type on a standard keyboard. We do about 25% of their schoolwork on the computer. That will increase as they get older. I alternate between having them handwrite essays and type them. They know how to google to research a subject. They have taught me a few things about computers from time to time, things they figured out on their own. Children tend to be very computer-savvy these days.
How do you go about teaching a subject you know very little about?
This is what I enjoy the most about homeschooling. When I am not very knowledgeable about a subject I spend time reading library books and researching the subject on the computer. I also ask someone I know – a respected teacher, a friend, or someone else who has more knowledge about it than me – they often pass along very helpful material. When I refresh my memory about a subject or learn about something before I teach it, it is exhilarating. Learning is fun for me, too! I can actually watch games shows now about Greek gods, literature, science and history and be able to answer most of the questions now, where before I would think to myself, “I kind of remember that, but don’t know” or “I have no idea!” After I learn more, my excitement carries over to my children.
How much homework do you give? Is it even called ‘homework’ when it’s assigned at home?
They don’t get homework. I have them do their assignments each schoolday, then we do a lot of extracurricular activities such as field trips, or reading fun books together, or even writing an essay about a fun experience. The ironic thing is that because we don’t have homework, we have a lot more time to do the fun, educational extracurricular activities. They tend to retain what they learn from these experiences much more readily. Rote memorization doesn’t accomplish much in our family. From time to time I have them do it, to keep their short-term memory sharp, but it doesn’t play a large role in their schooling at home.
Do your students have to take the same standardized tests as mine? Mine take the SATs. They have been taking them since Kindergarten, but they were in private school when they first started taking them. We are going on our third year homeschooling now, and I was pleased to find out that they would be taking exact same SAT test as when they were in private school.
If so, how much test prep do you do each week? In short, I want to know your best (and worst) practices.
I buy the Spectrum Test Prep books for their grade. The first year I homeschooled, about once a week, I would have them do a test or two from the booklets. Whatever they didn’t know, we would go over the next day. This seems to have worked well. What didn’t work well was last year, on top of the Spectrum test prep booklets, I had my children take another comprehensive test that my teacher friend gave me copies of. I had them spend a whole week doing nothing but the practice tests. They hated it and were in a terrible mood that week – overtired, cranky and overworked. I think it works much better when test preparation is spaced out over the school year. There was no difference in the results of their tests from the first year of homeschooling and this past year. My oldest child’s composite score averaged almost five grades ahead and my younger child’s was two grades ahead. The funny thing is that I consider myself pretty laid back with the homeschooling. They only spend two hours each schoolday doing traditional schoolwork. It seems like they are retaining the info better with the more laid back approach. While they were in private school, they also did well, but were not quite as far ahead. I would have been happy if they were at grade level, so it has been very rewarding to find out how well they’re doing.
And as homeschool teachers, aren’t you just as curious about the life of a public school teacher? If for nothing else, to rethink and reshape your own teaching philosophies?
Sure, I’m curious. I’m curious about almost everything! One of my dearest friends was a sixth grade public school science teacher. She let me sit in on her class. She was amazing. She had an innate ability to captivate her students. (she would make a phenomenal homeschool teacher, but I’ll admit that these public school children are benefiting by her presence and I wouldn’t want to take that away from them – lol) I learned a lot from her and asked her a lot of questions. I continue to get advice from anyone who might be able to help me with schooling – other homeschool parents mostly, because I am in contact with them the most. Some of the homeschooled kids I meet are absolutely amazing! I want to find out what approach their parents have used with them. But many of these homeschooling parents used to be teachers themselves. I think there is a misconception that homeschool parents don’t have much knowledge of what goes on in public school, but so many homeschooling parents used to be public school teachers! They are often the ones who end up speaking out against public schooling the most. But most homeschooling parents have nothing against public school or private school. They are homeschooling because it is working out the best for the family for whatever reason.
“The Geeks vs. The Idiot. Homeschools vs. public schools. Yawn.” It’s awl just awwwfully boooring to you, huh? Nice starting off with a most condescending tone.
Your question about whether HSers are curious about public school teachers make me laugh my ass off. Most have already seen the inside workings of a public school, and that’s why they chose to teach at home. As a wise man once said, “Duh.”
Here’s how I read this article:
“See? Look at open-minded me. I’m being so very interested in you… Now, enough about you… don’t you wanna know about ME?!”
Your answer? Um. NO.
Whether they do it in a public school, private school, or at home, teachers are teachers. That’s what I thought this website was for and by [see your About page].
You and your buddy Jesse have succeeded in alienating a large chunk of your passionate, caring, intelligent colleagues.
Well, Fritchelsnit, once again you’ve arrived a year late and with nothing to contribute. You can’t keep doing this.
I read your argument and I know everyone is welcome to his/her opinion on this blog. But I must say it is jaw dropping how off the mark you are on your criticism of Alistair. You totally misread what he was trying to do. It is well known what a dedicated teacher he is and that he puts his heart and soul into a job and a blog that he loves. And no, it is not awfully boring to him. Your assumption that he thinks “don’t you wanna know about ME?” is simply wrong. That attitude is not in his make-up. Don’t put words in his mouth that he would never say.
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I just thought that I would say that a public school teacher hugs a homeschool teacher every day when my father comes home from work and hugs my mom.
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I’m worse, I’m now 2 years late. lol I wanted to say thank you for this, because I was able to read and enjoy the responses. Personally, I’m a homeschooler, but our neighbor is a public school teacher. We’ve had many discussions about this very topic, and we both find it fun and interesting to see the other side of the fence. Just FYI, most states have different rules and regulations when it comes to homeschooling. Some are fairly relaxed, others are fairly rigid.
I have a few questions myself for a public school teacher. Do you find yourself smothered by helicopter parents? How do you deal with that? Are anti-bullying policies working as well as you hope? How do you handle prepping your students for yearly tests? Do you get incentives for having the highest placed class (via the tests)?
Okay, now I’m going to try to answer your questions in the order they were asked:
1. We don’t feel we have to balance the parent/teacher relationship. Yes, we have set school hours in our home, but that doesn’t mean the teaching stops at three, or that being a parent only begins in the late afternoon. However, when school ends, that means anything structured is officially over, and during school hours we don’t bring up the chore chart or dentist appointments.
2. We use technology for plenty of things, including our computer for Khan University, Educational Videos on Netflix, testing, educational games, and even Computer Class.
3. If there’s a subject I feel shaky about, I educate myself. There are plenty of resources, including family and friends, to help me out. My children actually enjoy learning things with me, especially World Culture.
4. We don’t give homework, however we do have long term projects such as book reports, star charting, mapping and creating our town in large scale, etc., which we work on during school hours.
5. In our state, we are required to test our children every three years; the results are kept by the parents and not the school system. My family doesn’t test prep, we simply teach at least to the state’s requirements for the appropriate grade level (you can usually find this on the state’s education website), though most times we actually end up teaching past that. It’s much easier to do that when it’s one-on-one. We can either take our children to certified establishments where they are administered the test, and it is graded by that establishment, or we can purchase the tests and administer them ourselves, then send them back to the appropriate establishment for grading.
Our best decision for homeschooling was joining a homeschool group. They have classes with the other children twice a month; all are taught by volunteer parents and/or professionals. Our children were able to participate in the yearly plays (one for the younger, one for the older), which took place in a restored 1930′s theater. What a thrill to see their plays on the marquee! There are also park days and group activities (including monthly field trips, holiday parties, talent shows, etc.). Very happy we did this.
Worst practice? Pajama School days. Yep, we learn while wearing pajamas, but I honestly don’t know if that’s a bad thing or not.
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Hi there, just wanted to mention, I enjoyed this article. It was inspiring. Keep on posting!
I am trying to find a teacher to homeschool my 12 yr old son.
His name is Jacob. He suffers from severe OCD which is preventing
him to attend school. He has panic attacks in every class. I did give it my best and try to homeschool him myself. Unfortunatly, he sees me as
his mother not his 6th grade teacher. It has been very challenging
for Jacob as well as the rest of the family when he is screaming, “please
Mommy, I can’t go today, I promise I’ll go tommorow”. The next day all promises are broken and he simply cannot overcome his anxiety. He is seeing a Physciatrist and is on medication. He just needs time to get himself together. Are you able to come to my home or I can come to you,whatever is most convenient for you. I hope you are the answer to my
prayers.
Sincerly,
Kathleen Gottlieb
Dear Teacher Revised,
I also enjoyed the tone of this post more than those generated by your initial posting. First impressions really do make a difference, don’t they.
With regard to your disappointment that homeschoolers were not more interested in what public schools look like, I think it would be fair to say that, despite the variety in public schools, most homeschoolers probably have more of an idea about public schools than public school teachers have about homeschooling. And most homeschooling parents have gone through the “gosh, what’s really going on in my child’s class” thing BEFORE they remove them and homeschool them, rather than after they post a rather arrogant and ignorant blog about something they aren’t that familiar with and then gasp like a startled virgin when the people they are talking about (somewhat predictably) take objection to it.
Thank you for being a teacher. Even though you aren’t homeschooling